Battle Spot Teambuilding Discussion & Help Thread (read post #453, page 19)

Any suggestions on how to deal with M-Sableye other than strong Fire-type physical attackers? I have a decent balanced team right now, but my primary counter to slow CM stackers such as Sableye, Suicune, Sylveon, etc is a Specs Trick Rotom and a Toxic stall Heatran, both of which don't work against M-Sableye for obvious reasons.
With the CCaT testing, I've led with Azu and taken our Special Def Mence (has Facade) to bait the Will o Wisp on the switch. It works brilliantly especially if you DD to use Sableye as set up bait.

That works on anything that like to lead & use WoW. Not good against fairies or ice-move-carrying waters.
 

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Any suggestions on how to deal with M-Sableye other than strong Fire-type physical attackers? I have a decent balanced team right now, but my primary counter to slow CM stackers such as Sableye, Suicune, Sylveon, etc is a Specs Trick Rotom and a Toxic stall Heatran, both of which don't work against M-Sableye for obvious reasons.
Like a01 said, Facade Salamence is fun. Sylveon can fight Calm Mind with Calm Mind (Rest + Sleep Talk or Snore offsets Will-O-Wisp) or just go for Specs. Assault Vest Mamo tanks boosted moves like a boss while fishing for a Fissure hit, but will probably be burned and therefor mostly useless afterwards. Assault Vest Lapras does the same with Sheer Cold and doesn't care about a burn. Glalie can set up a sub to avoid a burn and has about 3-4 chances to hit a Sheer Cold, and after taking out Sableye it's safe behind a sub to begin Moody shenanigans. Mega Mawile can offset a burn with Swords Dance and destroy Sableye. I keep my Heracross unevolved if facing a Sableye and take advantage of Guts to bust through, although you need back-to-back 4/5 hits in a row with Pin Missile to out-damage Recover, and also not miss. Even Azumarill isn't phased by a burn too much, Belly Drum is essentially at +3 after a burn and OHKOes with Play Rough, and banded can still 2HKO after a burn. I've even used Dragon Dance Facade Mega Altaria which is fun as well.

Since Sableye isn't really common at all I don't think dedicating a gimmick to it is necessary, but there are options. Gliscor can Fling its Toxic Orb at Mega Sableye, which bypasses Magic Bounce to badly poison it. Gliscor will also be immune to burn thanks to its own poison, and can whittle Sableye down with Acrobatics and even use Swords Dance...
 
Any suggestions on how to deal with M-Sableye other than strong Fire-type physical attackers? I have a decent balanced team right now, but my primary counter to slow CM stackers such as Sableye, Suicune, Sylveon, etc is a Specs Trick Rotom and a Toxic stall Heatran, both of which don't work against M-Sableye for obvious reasons.
Guessing Singles. One really good answer to it I've used is Mega Altaria. Hyper Voice could probably work, but I used an offensive DD one with Facade. Malt can take most any hit from Sab, and it'll likely want to burn if it knows you're physical.

Mostly anything that can take dark attacks and handle being burned(or avoiding it,) while still being able to hit back. SD Lum Chomp works, as do most things that boost and can have Lum. Mence can DD and have a Facade that hits, and Mega Pinsir might work too. You get the idea.
 
Like a01 said, Facade Salamence is fun. Sylveon can fight Calm Mind with Calm Mind (Rest + Sleep Talk or Snore offsets Will-O-Wisp) or just go for Specs. Assault Vest Mamo tanks boosted moves like a boss while fishing for a Fissure hit, but will probably be burned and therefor mostly useless afterwards. Assault Vest Lapras does the same with Sheer Cold and doesn't care about a burn. Glalie can set up a sub to avoid a burn and has about 3-4 chances to hit a Sheer Cold, and after taking out Sableye it's safe behind a sub to begin Moody shenanigans. Mega Mawile can offset a burn with Swords Dance and destroy Sableye. I keep my Heracross unevolved if facing a Sableye and take advantage of Guts to bust through, although you need back-to-back 4/5 hits in a row with Pin Missile to out-damage Recover, and also not miss. Even Azumarill isn't phased by a burn too much, Belly Drum is essentially at +3 after a burn and OHKOes with Play Rough, and banded can still 2HKO after a burn. I've even used Dragon Dance Facade Mega Altaria which is fun as well.

Since Sableye isn't really common at all I don't think dedicating a gimmick to it is necessary, but there are options. Gliscor can Fling its Toxic Orb at Mega Sableye, which bypasses Magic Bounce to badly poison it. Gliscor will also be immune to burn thanks to its own poison, and can whittle Sableye down with Acrobatics and even use Swords Dance...
Fling a toxic orb at a magic bouncer seems so funny and really good!
 
Fling a toxic orb at a magic bouncer seems so funny and really good!
lol, you would latch onto that ;)

Gliscor is pretty great, I used to be terrified of the thing since I couldn't ever it hit it, just the sub lol. But Fling is super niche, less common even then Stealth Rock, and I have no idea why you'd use that. Plus there's only one Magic Bouncer that'd hate Fling lol, and even that's not that common(or even hard to deal with tbh.)

Anyways, no one should use Fling on Gliscor. It has many options it can mess around with like SD, Aerial Ace, and rock attacks, but Fling shouldn't be one of them. Unless you have a huge Trick Choice mon weakness...but Trick fails if you're subbed. Would be hilarious if you got Tricked and flung Specs or a Scarf right back tho lol.
 

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lol, you would latch onto that ;)

Gliscor is pretty great, I used to be terrified of the thing since I couldn't ever it hit it, just the sub lol. But Fling is super niche, less common even then Stealth Rock, and I have no idea why you'd use that. Plus there's only one Magic Bouncer that'd hate Fling lol, and even that's not that common(or even hard to deal with tbh.)

Anyways, no one should use Fling on Gliscor. It has many options it can mess around with like SD, Aerial Ace, and rock attacks, but Fling shouldn't be one of them. Unless you have a huge Trick Choice mon weakness...but Trick fails if you're subbed. Would be hilarious if you got Tricked and flung Specs or a Scarf right back tho lol.
Why should no one "ever" use it? Just because it has low usage? If it has a legitimate use then you can't write if off that simply. Fling + Light Ball Garchomp has even less usage but we consider that an actual gimmick, so why can't Fling + Acrobatics on Giscor be considered one? Unless of course you mean something like "there are way better Flying-type move spammers in the metagame such as Talonflame and there's no reason to use Gliscor over them" because then you'd have a case, but I'm not a fan of the "usage" argument being used so often. For what it's worth; I've run into a Fling Gliscor and it messed me up real bad.
 
Why should no one "ever" use it? Just because it has low usage? If it has a legitimate use then you can't write if off that simply. Fling + Light Ball Garchomp has even less usage but we consider that an actual gimmick, so why can't Fling + Acrobatics on Giscor be considered one? Unless of course you mean something like "there are way better Flying-type move spammers in the metagame such as Talonflame and there's no reason to use Gliscor over them" because then you'd have a case, but I'm not a fan of the "usage" argument being used so often. For what it's worth; I've run into a Fling Gliscor and it messed me up real bad.
I'm guessing you mean so often by me and not in general.

Anyways that's a really good point on other flying spammers, would've been a better way to explain why it just isn't the best. Fling and Acrobatics means you can only have two of the moves Glis adores having, mainly Sub, Protect, EQ, Toxic and Guillotine. Too much 4MSS, and Sub with Poison really is really tough, especially with status support. And I wasn't saying it couldn't be considered a gimmick...what else would it be called lol.
 

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I'm guessing you mean so often by me and not in general.
no, actually.

Anyways that's a really good point on other flying spammers, would've been a better way to explain why it just isn't the best. Fling and Acrobatics means you can only have two of the moves Glis adores having, mainly Sub, Protect, EQ, Toxic and Guillotine. Too much 4MSS, and Sub with Poison really is really tough, especially with status support. And I wasn't saying it couldn't be considered a gimmick...what else would it be called lol.
But that's the thing, Gliscor doesn't want to use SubProtect, Toxic, or Guillotine on a Fling + Acrobatics set. Again, you're looking at usage stats and assuming it wants to use those all the time, rather than what the point of the set is and how it would be used.

I found a high ranking team that used a Gliscor like this: here's the set

Gliscor @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
EVs: 212 HP / 4 Atk / 60 Def / 116 SpD / 116 Spe
- Fling
- Acrobatics
- Earthquake
- Protect

Outspeeds max Heatran and survives a max SpA M-Gengar's Hex. Defense is just for extra bulk, I'd probably move it to either attack or SpD... However, the reason Gliscor was brought up was as a way to mess up Mega Sableye, but the team it's on has Mega Charizard X which doesn't care about Sab anyway lol.
 
Hey guys, I just recently started doing battle spot singles and it's actually much more fun than I thought it would be (I use to hate the idea of 3v3 rather than 6v6, I've now seen the light). I'm trying to build a better team because none of my teams have given me much result or I just suck. Anyways, I have a question about charizard y and volcarona, they seem very similar to me, I was looking for something with fire type moves along with other coverage and these two popped up. Is one of them usually better to use than the other? Thanks.
 

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Hey guys, I just recently started doing battle spot singles and it's actually much more fun than I thought it would be (I use to hate the idea of 3v3 rather than 6v6, I've now seen the light). I'm trying to build a better team because none of my teams have given me much result or I just suck. Anyways, I have a question about charizard y and volcarona, they seem very similar to me, I was looking for something with fire type moves along with other coverage and these two popped up. Is one of them usually better to use than the other? Thanks.
Charizard Y requires a mega stone, meaning you can't use it at the same time as Mega Kangaskhan, Mega Salamence, Mega Gengar, or Mega Mawile. So if you have other megas you want to use then Volcarona wins on that front. Volcarona can also boost with Quiver Dance, which can allow it to get out of control very quickly.

On the other hand, Charizard Y isn't scared off by Azumarill, as the sun support stop Aqua Jet from picking it off and Solar Beam OHKOes most variants. Volcarona can't do anything and risks letting the Azumarill get a Belly Drum off, which can often lead to a sweep. Charizard also hits like an absolute truck as soon as it hits the field, Fire Blast / Overheat hurt a lot of things really bad, and Solar Beam hits most of the rest. Volcarona needs to get a boost in to even compete for similar damage, but it's coverage isn't as good as you've basically got only the three slots left.

Charizard also imposes a lot of pressure at team preview; it it X or Y? This can cause your opponent to bring the wrong check, or two checks (one for each) and gives you a slight edge in momentum from the start.

So the decision between the two is kinda tricky, but it basically boils down to whether you have megas or not, or if you'd rather a set up sweeper or wallbreaker.
 
Charizard Y requires a mega stone, meaning you can't use it at the same time as Mega Kangaskhan, Mega Salamence, Mega Gengar, or Mega Mawile. So if you have other megas you want to use then Volcarona wins on that front. Volcarona can also boost with Quiver Dance, which can allow it to get out of control very quickly.

On the other hand, Charizard Y isn't scared off by Azumarill, as the sun support stop Aqua Jet from picking it off and Solar Beam OHKOes most variants. Volcarona can't do anything and risks letting the Azumarill get a Belly Drum off, which can often lead to a sweep. Charizard also hits like an absolute truck as soon as it hits the field, Fire Blast / Overheat hurt a lot of things really bad, and Solar Beam hits most of the rest. Volcarona needs to get a boost in to even compete for similar damage, but it's coverage isn't as good as you've basically got only the three slots left.

Charizard also imposes a lot of pressure at team preview; it it X or Y? This can cause your opponent to bring the wrong check, or two checks (one for each) and gives you a slight edge in momentum from the start.

So the decision between the two is kinda tricky, but it basically boils down to whether you have megas or not, or if you'd rather a set up sweeper or wallbreaker.
Thank you! That was very informative, definitely helped me decide which to put on my team
 
Hey! I have a team that has worked well for me, but I made it from scratch with zero experience. While I love it cause I worked so hard on it, I want to get better. Could you tell me how this team could be better? I prefer to play in Battle Spot doubles and singles.

Garchomp @ Garchompite
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 252 HP / 156 SpD / 100 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earth Power
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock
- Outrage

Togekiss @ Lum Berry
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 HP / 128 SpA / 128 Spe
Timid Nature
- Heal Bell
- Protect
- Dazzling Gleam
- Nasty Plot

Blaziken @ Life Orb
Ability: Speed Boost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Knock Off
- Swords Dance
- Flare Blitz
- Low Kick

Vaporeon @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 HP / 160 Def / 96 Spe
Bold Nature
- Protect
- Baton Pass
- Scald
- Wish

Metagross @ Assault Vest
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 252 HP / 180 Atk / 76 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Shadow Ball
- Iron Head
- Earthquake
- Sludge Bomb

Electivire @ King's Rock
Ability: Motor Drive
EVs: 252 HP / 110 Atk / 36 Def / 112 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Magnet Rise
- Wild Charge
- Fire Punch
- Ice Punch
 
Last edited by a moderator:

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Hey! I have a team that has worked well for me, but I made it from scratch with zero experience. While I love it cause I worked so hard on it, I want to get better. Could you tell me how this team could be better? I prefer to play in Battle Spot doubles and singles.

Garchomp @ Garchompite
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 252 HP / 156 SpD / 100 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earth Power
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock
- Outrage

Togekiss @ Lum Berry
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 HP / 128 SpA / 128 Spe
Timid Nature
- Heal Bell
- Protect
- Dazzling Gleam
- Nasty Plot

Blaziken @ Life Orb
Ability: Speed Boost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Knock Off
- Swords Dance
- Flare Blitz
- Low Kick

Vaporeon @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 HP / 160 Def / 96 Spe
Bold Nature
- Protect
- Baton Pass
- Scald
- Wish

Metagross @ Assault Vest
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 252 HP / 180 Atk / 76 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Shadow Ball
- Iron Head
- Earthquake
- Sludge Bomb

Electivire @ King's Rock
Ability: Motor Drive
EVs: 252 HP / 110 Atk / 36 Def / 112 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Magnet Rise
- Wild Charge
- Fire Punch
- Ice Punch
Ok so where to begin? Firstly, I edited your post so your sets are using the "standard" format so it's easier to read, I was having trouble reading the sets because it wasn't very well organised.

Now, I need to explain EVs to you. Battle Spot is played at level 50, and EVs work differently there than at level 100. At level 50, EVs need to be divisible by 4 but not 8, so the effective EV numbers are 4, 12, 20, 28, 36 ...... 228, 236, 244, 252 (I skipped a few obviously). The easiest way to make sure you're using an efficient EV spread is to load up Pokemon Showdown Teambuilder, select Battle Spot Singles or Doubles as the format so the levels are automatically set at 50, and use the sliders to adjust the EVs. The teambuilder won't let you waste EVs that way. Or you can use my Damage Calculator and enter the EVs there. You'll notice that the actual stat won't increase or drop unless you enter the right value...

I also need to know what this team is for. It absolutely cannot be both a Singles and Doubles team at the same time, you need to decide which to focus on. I can't give any specific metagame advice until I know which format you intend to use this team in. I'll comment on some stuff though.

Mega Garchomp is seen as inferior to its regular forme as the drop in speed is a huge point against it. Regular Garchomp's base 102 speed is one of the best speed tiers in the game. You can see how unpopular Mega Garchomp is on the Pokemon Global Link's stats page; Garchompite is only used on 0.7% of Garchomp in Singles, and 4.4% in Doubles. Earth Power also makes no sense on both a physical attacker or something carrying Earthquake.

Togekiss' set is all over the place. It's got Nasty Plot, but it's also got Heal Bell. It has Dazzling Gleam but no Air Slash. It has Lum Berry and not Sitrus / Leftovers / Choice Scarf. I just think you need to check out Togekiss' analysis entry and see what would make a good set for it.

Blaziken is the only Pokemon that makes sense here so I won't comment too much. However Protect is usually a good idea so you can get a free Speed Boost if needed.

Vaporeon doesn't make sense. Why Baton Pass? You don't have anything to pass off. It's also important to note that Suicune outclasses it in basically every area so if you can get one I'd highly recommend using it. Check out Theorymon's Giveaway for that.

Why are you using Shadow Ball and Sludge Bomb on Metagross? It's a physical attacker, so special moves don't work. It has Steel-STAB for Fairy-types so I don't know what you're trying to hit with Sludge Bomb, and Shadow Ball for other Psychics / Ghosts is silly.

Electivire is not a good Pokemon. A lot of new players make this mistake and think he's amazing due to its coverage and ability, but it lacks power and the ability is easy to play around.

That's about all I can offer. If you want to practice with some sample teams or get some ideas, check out our Top Japanese Teams thread. For Doubles, we have the Sample Teams thread as well.
 
Ok so where to begin? Firstly, I edited your post so your sets are using the "standard" format so it's easier to read, I was having trouble reading the sets because it wasn't very well organised.

Now, I need to explain EVs to you. Battle Spot is played at level 50, and EVs work differently there than at level 100. At level 50, EVs need to be divisible by 4 but not 8, so the effective EV numbers are 4, 12, 20, 28, 36 ...... 228, 236, 244, 252 (I skipped a few obviously). The easiest way to make sure you're using an efficient EV spread is to load up Pokemon Showdown Teambuilder, select Battle Spot Singles or Doubles as the format so the levels are automatically set at 50, and use the sliders to adjust the EVs. The teambuilder won't let you waste EVs that way. Or you can use my Damage Calculator and enter the EVs there. You'll notice that the actual stat won't increase or drop unless you enter the right value...

I also need to know what this team is for. It absolutely cannot be both a Singles and Doubles team at the same time, you need to decide which to focus on. I can't give any specific metagame advice until I know which format you intend to use this team in. I'll comment on some stuff though.

Mega Garchomp is seen as inferior to its regular forme as the drop in speed is a huge point against it. Regular Garchomp's base 102 speed is one of the best speed tiers in the game. You can see how unpopular Mega Garchomp is on the Pokemon Global Link's stats page; Garchompite is only used on 0.7% of Garchomp in Singles, and 4.4% in Doubles. Earth Power also makes no sense on both a physical attacker or something carrying Earthquake.

Togekiss' set is all over the place. It's got Nasty Plot, but it's also got Heal Bell. It has Dazzling Gleam but no Air Slash. It has Lum Berry and not Sitrus / Leftovers / Choice Scarf. I just think you need to check out Togekiss' analysis entry and see what would make a good set for it.

Blaziken is the only Pokemon that makes sense here so I won't comment too much. However Protect is usually a good idea so you can get a free Speed Boost if needed.

Vaporeon doesn't make sense. Why Baton Pass? You don't have anything to pass off. It's also important to note that Suicune outclasses it in basically every area so if you can get one I'd highly recommend using it. Check out Theorymon's Giveaway for that.

Why are you using Shadow Ball and Sludge Bomb on Metagross? It's a physical attacker, so special moves don't work. It has Steel-STAB for Fairy-types so I don't know what you're trying to hit with Sludge Bomb, and Shadow Ball for other Psychics / Ghosts is silly.

Electivire is not a good Pokemon. A lot of new players make this mistake and think he's amazing due to its coverage and ability, but it lacks power and the ability is easy to play around.

That's about all I can offer. If you want to practice with some sample teams or get some ideas, check out our Top Japanese Teams thread. For Doubles, we have the Sample Teams thread as well.
Sorry for the confusing format, I'll do it correctly next time I have a question.

To be honest, I thought I could use a team for both singles and doubles. But thanks to you, now I know! There is much I still need to learn. I think I want a team for both, but I will work on just a singles team first.

It seems I need to change a lot, which is fine. It is, after-all, my first go at making my own competitive team. You gave me what I asked for, a critique of my team and what I can do better. Thank you. I also thank you for these links! They'll help me out a lot with the work I got ahead of me.
 
Sorry for the confusing format, I'll do it correctly next time I have a question.

To be honest, I thought I could use a team for both singles and doubles. But thanks to you, now I know! There is much I still need to learn. I think I want a team for both, but I will work on just a singles team first.

It seems I need to change a lot, which is fine. It is, after-all, my first go at making my own competitive team. You gave me what I asked for, a critique of my team and what I can do better. Thank you. I also thank you for these links! They'll help me out a lot with the work I got ahead of me.
Singles is usually best to start, and this looks more like a BSS team anyways. Ofc that means no Protect on Togekiss.

Garchomp the EVs are extremely odd to me, but maybe they make more sense for a mega. Normally though you want max Atk and Spe and the 4 in SpD(or W/e really,) on any item. Rock Tomb is a really good move, any Garchomp should have rock coverage.

Since Chomp should not be the mega that slot is free, so you want Blaziken to be the mega. You might be able to get away without Protect, but I'm not sure about Low Kick. On full physical ones you usually want High Jump Kick. More damage thn LK even when the foe is really heavy, and way more to things like Rotom forms and most everything in general.

Lastly, while Electivire is unviable, you should also note that a mon without Skill Link and multi-hit moves should never use King's Rock-the chance to flinch with just one hit is too low to forego using a much more reliable item. On offensive electric types, Magnet Rise is also not that great, particularly if they fail to outspeed Chomp(though most do outspeed, really it's just the bad ones that don't.)
 
Singles is usually best to start, and this looks more like a BSS team anyways. Ofc that means no Protect on Togekiss.

Garchomp the EVs are extremely odd to me, but maybe they make more sense for a mega. Normally though you want max Atk and Spe and the 4 in SpD(or W/e really,) on any item. Rock Tomb is a really good move, any Garchomp should have rock coverage.

Since Chomp should not be the mega that slot is free, so you want Blaziken to be the mega. You might be able to get away without Protect, but I'm not sure about Low Kick. On full physical ones you usually want High Jump Kick. More damage thn LK even when the foe is really heavy, and way more to things like Rotom forms and most everything in general.

Lastly, while Electivire is unviable, you should also note that a mon without Skill Link and multi-hit moves should never use King's Rock-the chance to flinch with just one hit is too low to forego using a much more reliable item. On offensive electric types, Magnet Rise is also not that great, particularly if they fail to outspeed Chomp(though most do outspeed, really it's just the bad ones that don't.)
Okay, thanks. I know it is recommended that Togekiss run Air Slash, but I'm wondering why? If I remember correctly, the damage output is rather low on top of a low attack stat. I do see why I should get rid of protect though.

Yeah, I did the chomp EVs to help with m-chomp's tankiness. Originally I went rocky helmet with the EVs you mentioned, but I figured making him mega with tanky EVs would give me the damage and durability I wanted. I will switch back though. I did enjoy watching physical attackers kill themselves against him lol. I'll put rock tomb on him for sure. Thanks for the advice!

I'll do that with Blaziken!

Oh, I didn't know that. Thanks for the info!
 
Okay, thanks. I know it is recommended that Togekiss run Air Slash, but I'm wondering why? If I remember correctly, the damage output is rather low on top of a low attack stat. I do see why I should get rid of protect though.
Air Slash is special. Togekiss has a great Special Attack stat.

The main reason though, is the fact that Serene Grace Air Slash has a 60% chance of making the target flinch, which means that everything that is slower than Togekiss only has a 40% to attack when you hit it with your Serene Grace Air Slash.
If you pair that with Thunder Wave, the odds become even worse for your opponent and it makes it easier to outspeed Pokémon and make them flinch.
 
Okay, thanks. I know it is recommended that Togekiss run Air Slash, but I'm wondering why? If I remember correctly, the damage output is rather low on top of a low attack stat. I do see why I should get rid of protect though.

Yeah, I did the chomp EVs to help with m-chomp's tankiness. Originally I went rocky helmet with the EVs you mentioned, but I figured making him mega with tanky EVs would give me the damage and durability I wanted. I will switch back though. I did enjoy watching physical attackers kill themselves against him lol. I'll put rock tomb on him for sure. Thanks for the advice!

I'll do that with Blaziken!

Oh, I didn't know that. Thanks for the info!
I wouldn't say recommended, more that it's required on any Togekiss. Best thing it has by fr, and also totally unique.

Chomp...this seems to be a common misconception with new people and I don't really get it. Helmet is just bad, Chomp does way better with Scarf, Band, Lum, Sash, or Yache Berry. Helmet is viable, but not good. Stats reflect this, as only 4% of Chomp are Helmet. Since Chomp is the most common mon, stats mean more, since it's obviously not just a couple bad people who run it and Helmet is overlooked.
 

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Okay, thanks. I know it is recommended that Togekiss run Air Slash, but I'm wondering why? If I remember correctly, the damage output is rather low on top of a low attack stat. I do see why I should get rid of protect though.

Yeah, I did the chomp EVs to help with m-chomp's tankiness. Originally I went rocky helmet with the EVs you mentioned, but I figured making him mega with tanky EVs would give me the damage and durability I wanted. I will switch back though. I did enjoy watching physical attackers kill themselves against him lol. I'll put rock tomb on him for sure. Thanks for the advice!

I'll do that with Blaziken!

Oh, I didn't know that. Thanks for the info!
Air Slash is the reason you use Togekiss, otherwise you use Sylveon.

Helmet Garchomp isn't necessarily bad, it just uses other items better. Helmet is really only an option on Impish sets with Stealth Rock, but Landorus-T does it better thanks to Intimidate.
 
Air Slash is special. Togekiss has a great Special Attack stat.

The main reason though, is the fact that Serene Grace Air Slash has a 60% chance of making the target flinch, which means that everything that is slower than Togekiss only has a 40% to attack when you hit it with your Serene Grace Air Slash.
If you pair that with Thunder Wave, the odds become even worse for your opponent and it makes it easier to outspeed Pokémon and make them flinch.
Oh. Well that makes a lot more sense! I'll definitely add it now.
 
I wouldn't say recommended, more that it's required on any Togekiss. Best thing it has by fr, and also totally unique.

Chomp...this seems to be a common misconception with new people and I don't really get it. Helmet is just bad, Chomp does way better with Scarf, Band, Lum, Sash, or Yache Berry. Helmet is viable, but not good. Stats reflect this, as only 4% of Chomp are Helmet. Since Chomp is the most common mon, stats mean more, since it's obviously not just a couple bad people who run it and Helmet is overlooked.
I see.

Okay thanks. I'll start playing around with the items you mentioned!
 
Hey guys! I recently started to play competitively and it's going fantastically, but I kinda wanna branch out of my team and make a new one. I'm really interested in the whole Rain/Trick room thing, but I kinda need help, if you guys don't mind.

What I have gathered from the internet and my mind thus far is this:

Mega Blastoise @Blastoiseite
Quiet (252 SpA 252 Hp 4 def)
Mega Launcher
-Fake out-
-Water spout
-Aura sphere
-Dark pulse.

Aromatisse
Relaxed (252hp ??? def ??? SpD)
Aroma Veil
Heal Pulse
Trick Room
Rain Dance
Dazzling Gleam

Turn one: Blastoise uses fakeout, normally on a pokemon that would threaten Aromatisse. Aromatisse uses Trick Room
Turn two: Aromatisse uses a) healpulse if blastoise has low HP, or rain dance. Blastoise spams water spout at full poweer while aromatisse keeps healing it. Great leads, not changing them. They have KOd whole teams by themselves.


Aegislash Lefties
Whatever +Def-Spe is (252Def 252 SpD 4 Att)
Stance change
-Shadow sneak
-Swords dance
-King's shield
-Sacred Sword.


Goodra Damp Rock
Quiet (252SpD 252 SpA 4 HP)
Hydration
-Rain dance
-Rest
-Muddy water
Dragon pulse

And possibly ferrothorn and gothithelle/chandelure? Wouldn't know how to build them though.

Any advice/suggestions would be hugely appreciated. Thank you in advance.
 
Hello. I wanted to know if it's worth having Garchomp and Tyranitar in the same team for Doubles. If it is, what's the best way to approach it? I'm new to Double Battles in general, so I would like some guidelines.
 
Generally, it's better to use 1 Landorus-t. Intimidate, better speed, and greater damage output all adds up to this. Physical Dragon type moves are too niche. Nevertheless, Landorus-t gets a bonus Superpower (especially for Mega Kang) and Knock Off (if you really want it).
 
Oh good, some doubles activity, I was getting worried for a while.
Hey guys! I recently started to play competitively and it's going fantastically, but I kinda wanna branch out of my team and make a new one. I'm really interested in the whole Rain/Trick room thing, but I kinda need help, if you guys don't mind.

What I have gathered from the internet and my mind thus far is this:

Mega Blastoise @Blastoiseite
Quiet (252 SpA 252 Hp 4 def)
Mega Launcher
-Fake out-
-Water spout
-Aura sphere
-Dark pulse.

Aromatisse
Relaxed (252hp ??? def ??? SpD)
Aroma Veil
Heal Pulse
Trick Room
Rain Dance
Dazzling Gleam

Turn one: Blastoise uses fakeout, normally on a pokemon that would threaten Aromatisse. Aromatisse uses Trick Room
Turn two: Aromatisse uses a) healpulse if blastoise has low HP, or rain dance. Blastoise spams water spout at full poweer while aromatisse keeps healing it. Great leads, not changing them. They have KOd whole teams by themselves.


Aegislash @ Leftovers
Whatever +Def-Spe is (252Def 252 SpD 4 Att)
Stance change
-Shadow sneak
-Swords dance
-King's shield
-Sacred Sword.


Goodra @ Damp Rock
Quiet (252SpD 252 SpA 4 HP)
Hydration
-Rain dance
-Rest
-Muddy water
Dragon pulse

And possibly ferrothorn and gothithelle/chandelure? Wouldn't know how to build them though.

Any advice/suggestions would be hugely appreciated. Thank you in advance.
Mega Blastoise and Aromatisse are fun, I've used both but not on the same team. Let me dig a bit on spreads.
ok, here:

Aromatisse @ Chesto Berry
Relaxed (+Def, -Spe), 252 HP, 196 Def, 56 Sp. Def
Ability: Aroma Veil

- Moonblast
- Rest
- Trick Room
- Heal Pulse

Blastoise @ Mega
Quiet, 252 HP, 252 Sp. Atk, 4 Sp. Def
Ability: Torrent (Mega Launcher)

- Water Spout
- Protect
- Fake Out
- Ice Beam

Aromatisse is a general spread, eats Khan's Double-Edge, Char-Y's Fire Blast, and 252+ Aegislash Flash Cannon (and Iron Head from non-existant physical sets).
Chesto-Rest with no Protect looks bizarre, I know, but it serves two-fold. Number one, eats a Dark Void / Spore to further assure setup, and number two, keeps Aromatisse healthy especially if it needs to eat a hit for setup. You generally want to avoid stalling Protect during TR. Rest and Heal Pulse keep both members of your duo at high HP.

Mega Blastoise is very standard set, doesn't need a specialized spread in TR. Tanks nearly any Thunderbolt or Solarbeam tossed at it.


After that you ABSOLUTELY REQUIRE an Amoonguss / Ferrothorn counter. I would look into Mega Camerupt as a double-mega option, but for non-megas Heatran is pretty good. Sub Aegislash also works and is able to set up against them. Escavalier is very dangerous and immune to Spore thanks to Overcoat, but doesn't do much to Ferrothorn.
Many TR teams run two Trick Room inducers, to better maintain control and adapt to different matchups. Best pairs for Aromatisee are Gothitelle, Cresselia, and Reuniclus. Goth traps and keeps matchups favorable, and offers Fake tears/Heal Pulse support for Blastoise. Cress has immense bulk for repeated TR sets, but offense is laughable and relies on Helping Hand; this falters if Blastoise is low on HP. Reuniclus does not trap, but is very hard hitting and is pretty flexible; you can run Magic Guard + LO, or Overcoat for Spore immunity. Heals itself via Recover to boot.

Goodra has excellent coverage but really needs LO to nab most KOs and its horrible Defense leaves you stuck against common physical mons like Khan, Landog, Terrakion, Mence, Mawile, etc. I don't suggest running it, its a niche mon usually added as a glue or blanket check to specialized threats.

Hello. I wanted to know if it's worth having Garchomp and Tyranitar in the same team for Doubles. If it is, what's the best way to approach it? I'm new to Double Battles in general, so I would like some guidelines.
They typically are not paired, as Chomp is used in general goodstuff and Sun teams while TTar appears most often as Japan Sand builds (TTar + Excadrill + Mence/Garde) that stack many weaknesses with Garchomp.
I HAVE, however, recently faced a brilliant, high-rated Japanese player running TTar / Suicune / Crobat / Gardevoir / Mence / Garchomp. This is a very technical team that is probably bad for beginners, but I will post it for interested people.
From what I gathered in the battle and video, his team flowed like this:

1) Garchomp and Mence were his megas. I will expand in a bit.
2) Gardevoir was Specs, a common VGC14 set that is basically forgotten these days. Serves as a surprise set to check opposing Dragons, fighting types, Amoonguss, etc. and bluff a mega.
3) Crobat and Suicune are dedicated Tailwind support, he brings one or the other based on matchups.
4) TTar was Scarf, a fairly standard set. Used to set Sand for Mega Chomp and has nice offense next to Mence. Fishes for flinches and is the main breaker to Cresselia.
5) Tailwind + Sand mega Chomp will rip your fucking nuts off in ways you do not want to imagine. Astronomical EQ spam and brutal Rock slides are not a joke.
6) Additionally, Garchomp functions very well as a Landog substitute, and runs adequately without an item if Mega Mence is chosen. Chomp + MegaMence is obviously Icy Wind bait, but without Gardevoir/Icy Wind mons on the field, Hyper Voice + EQ hurts and Flying + Ground is great coverage. Ttar/Chomp handles Zapdos/Thundy pretty well.

If you can grasp his team I dare say it's pretty damn eloquent and creative. He was 1757 when I saw him and that's higher than I ever got LOL.
Unfortunately he was no match for the Weakness Policy, Hammer Arm + Ice Punch Regirock I was running once he set up Sand. He didn't bring the Suicune.

In general Mega Garchomp should not be used, but TTar + Chomp needs serious Fairy support if you run it. Non-Mega Chompy is great imo, I usually run it LO but AV with Iron Head is pretty comical too. Brightpowder Sand Veil could also bring back some nightmares, ask anyone who played 4th Gen OU. lol.

Generally, it's better to use 1 Landorus-t. Intimidate, better speed, and greater damage output all adds up to this. Physical Dragon type moves are too niche. Nevertheless, Landorus-t gets a bonus Superpower (especially for Mega Kang) and Knock Off (if you really want it).
Generally yes, but Garchomp is by no means bad at all in Doubles. Yes, Landog is far more popular, and yes, Landog does usually beat Chomp.
Garchomp does have a fair few resistances (Rock, Fire, neutral to Water) and there is a LOT of stuff between 91 and 102 Speed. So I'm not sure where "Better speed" comes from. Scarf sets Chomp can also do, but it doesn't literally depend on it to outrun anything faster than CB Arcanine. Dragon STAB is generally balls, I agree. LO Dual Chop is excellent against Gengar (OHKOs Sash / LO, good hit if it's mega), while Draco Meteor is funny against Mence, Hydreigon, and Landorus. I've also dropped Dragon STAB entirely for lulzy things like SD and Sub (which are fairly decent) since it's hardly used. Fairy / Dragon weaknesses hurt but Landog isn't much happier eating Hyper Voice or Hydra DMs.
Garchomp's secondary Dragon STABs (Dual Chop/Dragon Claw/Draco) are a lot better than Landog's secondary Flying STABs (...Fly? HP Flying?) too, j/s.
Anyway a lot of Garchomp's appeal is natural Speed and the fact that it does NOT have Intimidate, meaning it isn't an outright liability against Bisharp / Milotic. Superior speed and Rough Skin also keeps Khan in check pretty well, she can't tangle with Garchomp without grievous damage, if not outright killed. Intimidate she can dodge by coming in AFTER Landog, and even better if it lacks Superpower / is Scarfed into Rock Slide.
Garchomp has also been picking up steam with higher rated (1650+) Japanese players, along with some North Americans from what I've seen.
As for power, EQ/Rock Slide have the same OHKOs and 2HKOs across both of them. Not like heatran, Char-Y, Talonflame, Metagross, Mawile, etc. are taking them particularly well.
I guess Garchomp is a bit bulkier without Intimidate thrown in (special mons, bisharp, switch-in after Intimidate) but that's mostly moot imo.

tl;dr Chomp is a lot better than people consider when grabbing Landog without 20 seconds thought. Rarely is either one a bad choice though.
 

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