[COMPLETED] Garchomp

alexwolf

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I am kinda late, but please add a bulky set:

<p>name: Bulky<br />
move 1: Stealth Rock
move 2: Earthquake
move 3: Fire Blast / Flamethrower
move 4: Dragon Tail / Toxic
ability: Rough Skin
item: Rocky Helmet / Leftovers
nature: ?
evs: 252 HP

I am not sure about the nature and the EVs. The same Garchomp used to run enough Speed to outrun Adamant Lucario, but now it will almost always be in its Mega Forme so i don't know if it's worth it. This set is also one of the best checks to Mega Kangaskhan there is.
 
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I am kinda late, but please add a bulky set:

<p>name: Bulky<br />
move 1: Stealth Rock
move 2: Earthquake
move 3: Fire Blast / Flamethrower
move 4: Dragon Claw / Dragon Tail / Toxic
ability: Rough Skin
item: Rocky Helmet / Leftovers
nature: ?
evs: 252 HP

I am not sure about the nature and the EVs. The same Garchomp used to run enough Speed to outrun Adamant Lucario, but now it will almost always be in its Mega Forme so i don't know if it's worth it. This set is also one of the best checks to Mega Kangaskhan there is.
Hate to tell you, but Stealth Rock is a Gen 5-Only move, as proven on Serebii. There is little to no point in using a defensive set until that becomes legal. I would also mention Protect in combination with Leftovers. Helps with scouting as well as getting a bit of recovery back.
 

alexwolf

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Stupid me i must stop posting on impulse. Still, i think that even without SR it might be worth a set, as its bulk is excellent, its coverage and power is great even with no investment, it has phazing, and most importantly Rough Skin + Rocky Helmet is excellent.
 
I would like to hear opinions on this set as I think it might be Garchomps best set in the current metagame, having barely any switch-ins and absolutely demolishing it's standard switch-ins without any kind of boost. I am pretty sure SOMALIA came up with it first, of course he could've taken it from someone else but you'll never know. This set does not only net surprise-kills very easily, it also weakens the counters of your respective sweeper. It is best used alongside Mega-Kangaskhan, as it destroys Skarmory and Ferrothorn, which, especially if they are carrying the Rocky Helmet will be a huge annoyance. Scizor and Swords Dance Aegislash also really appreciate having those removed while mixed Aegislash has even more synergy because it does a ton (between 70% and 90% if you're using modest max SpA Life Orb) to Gliscor and Landorus-Therian, two pokemon that can just straight up wall this Garchomp set. Defensive walls that are not weak to Fireblast will wall this set, Hippowdon, Slowbro and Donphan come to my mind. Those are also lured in and two-hit or ohko'ed by Aegislash, just to mention it. This set definitely does perform worse once it is fully revealed. Still, it is very hard to Life Orb stall since Garchomp is immune to Sandstorm and resists Stealth Rock when switching in. Spikes prove to be very problematic, so this set is best ran with Rapid Spin or Defog support. I did the EV spread myself, it is far from perfect but it's definitely not bad. 54 SpA EV's give you a 56% chance to OHKO the standard 164 SpD Ferrothorn after Stealth Rocks. It also gives you a small numbers-jump, which is why I used this exact number. Dragon Claw is preferred over Outrage because you will be having to switch up moves a lot and you don't want to be easily revenge-killed by Mamoswine or Choice Scarfers. The introduction of Mega-Evolutions made Garchomp a lot more powerful in my opinion, even though new fast threats like Greninja and Noivern will be causing problems. Those are checks, not counters and will get obliterated by Earthquake and Dragon Claw respectively. His odd base-speed lets it outspeed Mega Charizard X and Y and it OHKO's both. Mega-Kangaskhan and Mega Pinsir are also both outsped and won't OHKO Garchomp with their priority because of it's good natural bulk. You can always go for accuracy over power, but you will lose some key KO's if you do that.



<p>Garchomp @ Life Orb<br />
Ability: Rough Skin <br 200 Atk /56 SpA / 252 Spe <br />
Naive Nature<br />
- Stone Edge / Rock Slide<br />
- Earthquake<br />
- Dragon Claw / Outrage<br />
- Fire Blast / Flamethrower<br /></p>

I will add some very important calcs to show how good this set really is:

52 SpA Life Orb Garchomp Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 164 SpD Ferrothorn: 307-364 (87.21 - 103.4%) -- 56.25% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
52 SpA Life Orb Garchomp Fire Blast vs. 224 HP / 32 SpD Skarmory: 255-302 (77.98 - 92.35%) -- 31.25% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
52 SpA Life Orb Garchomp Fire Blast vs. 224 HP / 252+ SpD Skarmory: 179-213 (54.74 - 65.13%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
200 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Stone Edge vs. 248 HP / 216+ Def Togekiss: 211-250 (56.56 - 67.02%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
200 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Stone Edge vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Togekiss: 286-338 (76.67 - 90.61%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
-1 200 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Stone Edge vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Gyarados: 221-263 (66.76 - 79.45%) -- 31.25% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
-1 200 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Stone Edge vs. 88 HP / 4 Def Gyarados: 221-263 (62.6 - 74.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
52 SpA Life Orb Garchomp Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Forretress: 598-707 (168.92 - 199.71%) -- guaranteed OHKO (might not seem important but this means you have a decent chance to OHKO in rain after Stealth Rocks)
200 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Dragon Claw vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Rotom-W: 156-185 (51.48 - 61.05%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
200 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Dragon Claw vs. 232 HP / 68+ Def Rotom-W: 133-157 (44.48 - 52.5%) -- 86.72% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock (I don't know how many Defense EV's people use, my Rotom-W is speedy with Leftovers, it outspeeds positively natured base 80's and the rest are out into Defense)
200 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Registeel: 289-343 (89.19 - 105.86%) -- 75% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock (Registeels base stars were changed to Aegislashs)
200 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Earthquake vs. 180 HP / 0 Def Tyranitar: 377-447 (97.66 - 115.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
200 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Earthquake vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Tyranitar: 377-447 (93.54 - 110.91%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
52 SpA Life Orb Garchomp Fire Blast vs. +1 252 HP / 216 SpD Scizor: 255-302 (74.12 - 87.79%) -- 6.25% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock (Assault Vest trapping Scizor, the most Specially Bulky set)
200 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Earthquake vs. 212 HP / 0 Def Azumarill: 247-292 (62.69 - 74.11%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
200 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Dragon Claw vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Dragonite: 439-517 (120.6 - 142.03%) -- guaranteed OHKO (Goodra's base stats were used)
200 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Stone Edge vs. 248 HP / 236+ Def Zapdos: 221-263 (57.7 - 68.66%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock


Ignore those unless you are interested in actually using it on the Pokébank-Ladder, those Pokémon are not obtainable by now.
200 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Dragon Claw vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Celebi: 165-195 (40.84 - 48.26%) -- 12.5% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
52 SpA Life Orb Garchomp Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 0+ SpD Celebi: 182-216 (45.04 - 53.46%) -- 92.58% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
200 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Earthquake vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Jellicent: 185-218 (45.9 - 54.09%) -- 97.66% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
200 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 36 Def Jellicent: 263-309 (65.09 - 76.48%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
 
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I would like to hear opinions on this set as I think it might be Garchomps best set in the current metagame, having barely any switch-ins and absolutely demolishing it's standard switch-ins without any kind of boost. I am pretty sure SOMALIA came up with it first, of course he could've taken it from someone else but you'll never know. This set does not only net surprise-kills very easily, it also weakens the counters of your respective sweeper. It is best used alongside Mega-Kangaskhan, as it destroys Skarmory and Ferrothorn, which, especially if they are carrying the Rocky Helmet will be a huge annoyance. Scizor and Swords Dance Aegislash also really appreciate having those removed while mixed Aegislash has even more synergy because it does a ton (between 70% and 90% if you're using modest max SpA Life Orb) to Gliscor and Landorus-Therian, two pokemon that can just straight up wall this Garchomp set. Defensive walls that are not weak to Fireblast will wall this set, Hippowdon, Slowbro and Donphan come to my mind. Those are also lured in and two-hit or ohko'ed by Aegislash, just to mention it. This set definitely does perform worse once it is fully revealed. Still, it is very hard to Life Orb stall since Garchomp is immune to Sandstorm and resists Stealth Rock when switching in. Spikes prove to be very problematic, so this set is best ran with Rapid Spin or Defog support. I did the EV spread myself, it is far from perfect but it's definitely not bad. 54 SpA EV's give you a 56% chance to OHKO the standard 164 SpD Ferrothorn after Stealth Rocks. It also gives you a small numbers-jump, which is why I used this exact number. Dragon Claw is preferred over Outrage because you will be having to switch up moves a lot and you don't want to be easily revenge-killed by Mamoswine or Choice Scarfers. The introduction of Mega-Evolutions made Garchomp a lot more powerful in my opinion, even though new fast threats like Greninja and Noivern will be causing problems. Those are checks, not counters and will get obliterated by Earthquake and Dragon Claw respectively. His odd base-speed lets it outspeed Mega Charizard X and Y and it OHKO's both. Mega-Kangaskhan and Mega Pinsir are also both outsped and won't OHKO Garchomp with their priority because of it's good natural bulk. Stealth Rock can also be ran if no one else on your team can afford to miss a move since it is the least useful coverage option, atleast in my opinion. You can always go for accuracy over power, but you will lose some key KO's if you do that.



<p>Garchomp @ Life Orb<br />
Ability: Rough Skin <br 200 Atk /56 SpA / 252 Spe <br />
Naive Nature<br />
- Stone Edge / Rock Slide / Stealth Rock<br />
- Earthquake<br />
- Dragon Claw / Outrage<br />
- Fire Blast / Flamethrower<br /></p>

I will add some very important calcs to show how good this set really is:

52 SpA Life Orb Garchomp Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 164 SpD Ferrothorn: 307-364 (87.21 - 103.4%) -- 56.25% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
52 SpA Life Orb Garchomp Fire Blast vs. 224 HP / 32 SpD Skarmory: 255-302 (77.98 - 92.35%) -- 31.25% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
52 SpA Life Orb Garchomp Fire Blast vs. 224 HP / 252+ SpD Skarmory: 179-213 (54.74 - 65.13%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
200 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Stone Edge vs. 248 HP / 216+ Def Togekiss: 211-250 (56.56 - 67.02%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
200 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Stone Edge vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Togekiss: 286-338 (76.67 - 90.61%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
-1 200 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Stone Edge vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Gyarados: 221-263 (66.76 - 79.45%) -- 31.25% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
-1 200 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Stone Edge vs. 88 HP / 4 Def Gyarados: 221-263 (62.6 - 74.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
52 SpA Life Orb Garchomp Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Forretress: 598-707 (168.92 - 199.71%) -- guaranteed OHKO (might not seem important but this means you have a decent chance to OHKO in rain after Stealth Rocks)
200 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Dragon Claw vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Rotom-W: 156-185 (51.48 - 61.05%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
200 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Dragon Claw vs. 232 HP / 68+ Def Rotom-W: 133-157 (44.48 - 52.5%) -- 86.72% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock (I don't know how many Defense EV's people use, my Rotom-W is speedy with Leftovers, it outspeeds positively natured base 80's and the rest are out into Defense)
200 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Registeel: 289-343 (89.19 - 105.86%) -- 75% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock (Registeels base stars were changed to Aegislashs)
200 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Earthquake vs. 180 HP / 0 Def Tyranitar: 377-447 (97.66 - 115.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
200 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Earthquake vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Tyranitar: 377-447 (93.54 - 110.91%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
52 SpA Life Orb Garchomp Fire Blast vs. +1 252 HP / 216 SpD Scizor: 255-302 (74.12 - 87.79%) -- 6.25% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock (Assault Vest trapping Scizor, the most Specially Bulky set)
200 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Earthquake vs. 212 HP / 0 Def Azumarill: 247-292 (62.69 - 74.11%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
200 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Dragon Claw vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Dragonite: 439-517 (120.6 - 142.03%) -- guaranteed OHKO (Goodra's base stats were used)
200 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Stone Edge vs. 248 HP / 236+ Def Zapdos: 221-263 (57.7 - 68.66%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock


Ignore those unless you are interested in actually using it on the Pokébank-Ladder, those Pokémon are not obtainable by now.
200 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Dragon Claw vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Celebi: 165-195 (40.84 - 48.26%) -- 12.5% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
52 SpA Life Orb Garchomp Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 0+ SpD Celebi: 182-216 (45.04 - 53.46%) -- 92.58% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
200 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Earthquake vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Jellicent: 185-218 (45.9 - 54.09%) -- 97.66% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
200 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 36 Def Jellicent: 263-309 (65.09 - 76.48%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
a mixed would be outclassed by a mixed mega chomp, which can get a sand force boost and land a good amount of those 2HKOes and OHKOes you listed. stealth rock is also illegal outside of Pokebank, of which this is analysis is not for.
 
I definitely get where you are coming from and you're right with what you're saying. I guess the question here is what exactly this set has over Mega-Garchomp. It's definitely not completely outclassed, for a couple of reasons. First of all, like I wrote in the introduction, Garchomp has an amazing speed-tier, which it loses when it evolves. Outspeeding base 100's is extremely important. Of course, you do not have to evolve Garchomp immedeatly, but it's still important. It also doesn't have to rely on sand to boost it's power. My last point is that this set performs almost as good as the Mega one whilst not using up your Mega spot and at the same time bluffing a Mega unless you have yours revealed or using a very obvious one like Manectric. As you said, it lands a good amount of the OHKOs and 2HKOs that Mega Chomp gets. I don't know if that's enough, but that's all I can think of for now. It also gets to keep Rough Skin, which can maybe possibly be useful.
 
LO Garchomp isn't actually that bad of a set and I would consider it to be one of the more threatening variants in this metagame. Fire Blast and Stone Edge handily disposes all of Skarmory, Forretress, Ferrothorn, Togekiss, Avalugg, Mega Aggron, Mandibuzz, and more. Dragon Claw and Earthquake are obvious staples. I definitely believe it deserves a set despite Mega Garchomp using a similar set for reasons skaybestrog stated above, specifically the ability to use another Mega in its place, such as Pinsir and Kangaskhan, or other Dragons in general that appreciate its support.
 
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If you want analysis on why the bulky set is good, just go look at the Druddigon WIP I did. Most of the same usage applies with some minor tweaks to the calcs since these pokemon are so similar at this role (with Garchomp being undeniably better for the most part save for lacking Sucker Punch, which it doesn't always need anyway). If Druddigon isn't viable due to being outclassed by Garchomp, then it's only fair the set is covered.
 

Shroomisaur

Smogon's fantastical fun-guy.
Yeah, this is another one of these analyses that's over a month old already. There's not a single Chomp set listed with any bulk, and a utility phazer Garchomp set should definitely be considered! Probably something like this:

Garchomp @ Rocky Helmet
Rough Skin
Jolly, 252 HP / 96 Def / 160 Spe
- Dragon Tail
- Earthquake
- Rock Slide
- Fire Blast / Toxic / Swords Dance

Jolly with 160 Spe beats Jolly Lucario and Adamant Mega Kangaskahn. The rest is invested in bulk, which helps Chomp to wear down physical attackers (Kanga) with Rough Skin + Rocky Helmet. Dragon Tail phazes and racks up residual damage, EQ is obvious STAB, and Rock Slide is the most accurate option that guarantees OHKOs on 192/0 Talonflame and Volcarona. The final moveslot is really filler until Pokebank (at which point it should be Stealth Rock).
 

McGrrr

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is a Contributor Alumnus
As discussed in the general Garchomp thread, I would suggest the following EV spreads:

1. +Speed / 252 Spd / 8 HP / 148 Atk / 100 Def: Earthquake deals a minimum of 148 damage to (4/0) Mega-Kangaskhan, thereby guaranteeing the KO with Rocky Helmet and Rough Skin: 148 + 2 * ( 58 + 44 ) = 352. Jolly PUP & +2 Sucker Punch 2HKOs less than 1% of the time.
2. +Attack / 252 Spd / 8 HP / 248 Def: Same as above, beats Jolly Excadrill.
3. +Attack / 192 Spd / 72 HP / 244 Def: Same as above, beats Jolly Gyarados/Dragonite.
4. +Attack / 16 Spd / 252 HP / 240 Def: Same as above, beats Jolly Tyranitar.

5. +Speed / 252 Spd / 4 HP / 252 Atk: Earthquake deals a minimum of 230 damage to (252/0) Aegislash-Shield, thereby guaranteeing the KO with Rocky Helmet and Rough Skin: 230 + 54 + 40 = 324.
6. +Attack / 252 Spd / 8 HP / 124 Atk / 124 Def: Same as above, beats Jolly Excadrill.
7. +Attack / 192 Spd / 8 HP / 124 Atk / 184 Def: Same as above, beats Jolly Gyarados/Dragonite.
8. +Attack / 16 Spd / 136 HP / 124 Atk / 232 Def: Same as above, beats Jolly Tyranitar.

Garchomp @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 252 Spd / 8 HP / 148 Atk / 100 Def
Jolly / Naive Nature
- Earthquake
- Dragon Claw / Outrage
- Stone Edge / Fire Blast
- Swords Dance / Toxic / Stealth Rock (bank obv)

Garchomp needs neutral Special Attack for the 2HKO on Skarmory:

0 SpA Garchomp Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Skarmory: 176-208 (52.6 - 62.2%)
 
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Shroomisaur

Smogon's fantastical fun-guy.
As discussed in the general Garchomp thread, I would suggest the following EV spreads:

1. +Speed / 252 Spd / 8 HP / 148 Atk / 100 Def: Earthquake deals a minimum of 148 damage to (4/0) Mega-Kangaskhan, thereby guaranteeing the KO with Rocky Helmet and Rough Skin: 148 + 2 * ( 58 + 44 ) = 352. Jolly PUP & +2 Sucker Punch 2HKOs less than 1% of the time.
I love that spread, I really do. It's made with a specific purpose in mind and pulls it off perfectly, thanks for sharing!

I'm just glad someone bumped this, because bulky Rocky Helmet Chomp needs a set. I like McGrrr's spread, however, I think Dragon Tail is far better than either other Dragon-type option for the sheer utility, and I guess Rock Slide/Stone Edge is up to preference. I've been using the set I posted with Swords Dance in the final slot and it works well, so I'm going to adopt this new EV spread for sure.
 
I think it's worth including a SpA EV spread for the mega evolve set

@Garchompite
Ability: Sand Force
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Earthquake
Fire Blast
Draco Meteor
Poison Jab/Stone Edge

Mega Garchomp's attack is pretty astronomical already; I've found this set lets me 2HKO just about everyone.
 
With how incredibly common Mega Kangaskhan is, it might be worth putting the anti-Mega Kanga set in there with Rough Skin and Rocky Helmet but it'll definitely be useless when Mega Kangaskhan is banned, so maybe not.
 
Shouldn't Outrage be slashed first over dragon claw for the choice scarf set? You are locked into dragon claw anyway due to choice scarf, so you might as well take the extra power. The only times when dragon claw would be better is if they don't switch to their fairy immediately giving you a double-switch opportunity or after you OKHO with outrage and they send in a boosting fairy. I think outrage's sheer power to guarantee a few important OHKO's outweighs that. Here are some calcs:

252 Atk Garchomp Dragon Claw vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Mega Charizard X: 240-284 (80.5 - 95.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Garchomp Outrage vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Mega Charizard X: 360-426 (120.8 - 142.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252 Atk Garchomp Dragon Claw vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Greninja: 181-214 (63.2 - 74.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252 Atk Garchomp Earthquake vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Greninja: 228-268 (79.7 - 93.7%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
252 Atk Garchomp Outrage vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Greninja: 271-321 (94.7 - 112.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

252 Atk Garchomp Dragon Claw vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Starmie: 151-178 (57.6 - 67.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252 Atk Garchomp Outrage vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Starmie: 225-265 (85.8 - 101.1%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
 
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With how incredibly common Mega Kangaskhan is, it might be worth putting the anti-Mega Kanga set in there with Rough Skin and Rocky Helmet but it'll definitely be useless when Mega Kangaskhan is banned, so maybe not.
It definately won't be useless when/if Mega Kangaskahn is banned. That set also crushes Talonflame and severely limits the options of many other common physical attackers.
 
It definately won't be useless when/if Mega Kangaskahn is banned. That set also crushes Talonflame and severely limits the options of many other common physical attackers.
Ah yeah that's a good point, actually. It always makes me smile that Talonflame relies on 1/3 recoil moves and then it loses 30% more of its health from Rocky Helmet+Rough Skin xD
 

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