Metagame Full Potential

SaturnZelda

formerly TylerWithNumbers
Somebody correct me if I'm wrong with the following calcs, because I would rather have than than realize just how overpowered Alola-Raichu--or rather, speed boosting abilities in general--is. Wall of text incoming.

According to calculations, a 110 base stat doubled (due to Surge Surfer) results in a total base stat of 247; that is, naturally, without counting EVs or nature. Slap a positive nature and some few EVs (let's use 80, as it's enough to outspeed an unchoiced Excadrill under sand) and we end up with a total of 605 in its highest stat. It means that, after a Choice Scarf, this reaches 907, and after one single Agility, this skyrockets up to 1210. Not even a Manaphy, under normal circumstances, would reach that much SpA after one Tail Glow.

And then, the damage calcs, with Life Orb. I will not use Hazards for these calculations. In order to to simulate its other stats, I have set its Attack and Speed to a base 255 with 236 EVs, reaching the value of 605:

80+ SpA Life Orb Raichu-Alola Thunderbolt vs. 4 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey in Electric Terrain: 247-292 (38.4 - 45.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
80+ SpA Life Orb Raichu-Alola Electro Ball (150 BP) vs. 4 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey in Electric Terrain: 411-485 (64 - 75.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
236 Atk Life Orb Raichu-Alola Extreme Speed vs. 4 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 253-299 (39.4 - 46.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

Swapping the Life Orb out for a Choice Scarf, it goes up to 907, as mentioned. I have boosted Attack, Special Attack and Speed to +1 for the sake of the simulation:

+1 80+ SpA Raichu-Alola Thunderbolt vs. 4 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey in Electric Terrain: 286-337 (44.5 - 52.4%) -- 21.5% chance to 2HKO
+1 80+ SpA Raichu-Alola Electro Ball (150 BP) vs. 4 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey in Electric Terrain: 474-558 (73.8 - 86.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+1 236 Atk Raichu-Alola Extreme Speed vs. 4 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 292-344 (45.4 - 53.5%) -- 41% chance to 2HKO

Swapping the Choice Scarf for, say, Life Orb again and then giving it an Agility Boost, I will increase all of the aforementioned stats to a +2 boost:

+2 80+ SpA Life Orb Raichu-Alola Thunderbolt vs. 4 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey in Electric Terrain: 493-581 (76.7 - 90.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+2 80+ SpA Life Orb Raichu-Alola Electro Ball (150 BP) vs. 4 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey in Electric Terrain: 820-967 (127.7 - 150.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 236 Atk Life Orb Raichu-Alola Extreme Speed vs. 4 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 506-595 (78.8 - 92.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

And there you have Raichu-A as the Pokémon that can not only oneshot a Chansey but also overkill it by a great margin. You can only ever respond to that with a sashed/Sturdy Pokémon, both of which go to waste if rocks are up. Potentially with a Scarfed Excadrill under sandstorm; as in, only if said Alola-Raichu is not scarfed or already boosted by Agility, or its Electric Terrain has ran out, but then chances are your team already has been tore up a gigantic hole. Otherwise, you can imagine how many times that Surf would kill it over.

Assault Vested Tyranitar can work if it's Life Orb or Choiced, but that requires said Tyranitar to be at least above half health:

80+ SpA Life Orb Raichu-Alola Thunderbolt vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Tyranitar: 153-183 (37.9 - 45.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
80+ SpA Life Orb Raichu-Alola Electro Ball (120 BP) vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Tyranitar: 208-246 (51.6 - 61%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

+1 80+ SpA Raichu-Alola Thunderbolt vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Tyranitar: 178-211 (44.1 - 52.3%) -- 19.1% chance to 2HKO
+1 80+ SpA Raichu-Alola Electro Ball (150 BP) vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Tyranitar: 297-351 (73.6 - 87%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

+2 outright kills it:

+2 80+ SpA Life Orb Raichu-Alola Thunderbolt vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Tyranitar: 308-364 (76.4 - 90.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+2 80+ SpA Life Orb Raichu-Alola Electro Ball (150 BP) vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Tyranitar: 516-608 (128 - 150.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Other Tapus can stop the murder train, but that also depends on the circumstance:

80+ SpA Life Orb Raichu-Alola Electro Ball (120 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Tapu Bulu: 107-126 (31.1 - 36.6%) -- guaranteed 4HKO after Grassy Terrain recovery
236 Atk Life Orb Raichu-Alola Extreme Speed vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Tapu Bulu: 169-200 (49.1 - 58.1%) -- 62.9% chance to 2HKO after Grassy Terrain recovery

+1 80+ SpA Raichu-Alola Electro Ball (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Tapu Bulu: 153-181 (44.4 - 52.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Grassy Terrain recovery
+1 236 Atk Raichu-Alola Extreme Speed vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Tapu Bulu: 196-231 (56.9 - 67.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Grassy Terrain recovery

+2 80+ SpA Life Orb Raichu-Alola Electro Ball (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Tapu Bulu: 265-313 (77 - 90.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Grassy Terrain recovery
+2 236 Atk Life Orb Raichu-Alola Extreme Speed vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Tapu Bulu: 338-399 (98.2 - 115.9%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO


80+ SpA Life Orb Raichu-Alola Electro Ball (80 BP) vs. 0 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Tapu Lele: 126-149 (44.8 - 53%) -- 29.7% chance to 2HKO
+1 80+ SpA Raichu-Alola Electro Ball (120 BP) vs. 0 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Tapu Lele: 216-255 (76.8 - 90.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+2 80+ SpA Life Orb Raichu-Alola Electro Ball (150 BP) vs. 0 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Tapu Lele: 468-551 (166.5 - 196%) -- guaranteed OHKO


80+ SpA Life Orb Raichu-Alola Electro Ball (80 BP) vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Tapu Fini: 229-273 (66.7 - 79.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
236 Atk Life Orb Raichu-Alola Extreme Speed vs. 248 HP / 192 Def Tapu Fini: 144-170 (41.9 - 49.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

While Fini is able to take an Electro Ball to the face, as long as it's not boosted, one Choice Scarf proves to be more than enough to oneshot it:

+1 80+ SpA Raichu-Alola Electro Ball (150 BP) vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Tapu Fini: 494-584 (144 - 170.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 80+ SpA Life Orb Raichu-Alola Electro Ball (150 BP) vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Tapu Fini: 858-1009 (250.1 - 294.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO

I believe this should suffice to prove how not only Alola-Raichu but essentially anything that has access to speed boosting abilities can turn out to be merciless and often gives you no answer other than to somehow abuse of those same broken settings. Or, dunno, forfeit.

I'm aware it has been mentioned time and time again that those abilities are broken in this meta, I just took the effort to calculate how destructive one of them can be.
Just a question, is that calc the equivalent of max Speed on Raichu inside Electric Terrain?
 
Just a question, is that calc the equivalent of max Speed on Raichu inside Electric Terrain?
Not max speed; I've calculated it with enough EVs to outspeed a non-Choice Scarf Excadrill under sandstorm. But if you mean if I have fully converted the speed stats into attacks, then yes, I've done that as I explained.
 
Well, what's the point in not running max Speed? All it does is allow you to hit harder.
The point flied over your head :T it was done so to show that even a Raichu-A not fully invested still hits like a truck, but with enough investment so that people won't ask what you just did. Anyhow, yes, fully invested will just hit harder, so I believe the point still stands.
 

RNGIsFatal

Banned deucer.
Got to semi finalist today in PS! tour so I could share this sandstorm team:

Lycanroc (M) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Sand Rush
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Rock Slide
- Fire Fang
- Sucker Punch
- Brick Break

Excadrill (M) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Sand Rush
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Earthquake
- Earth Power
- Iron Head
- Rock Slide

Nihilego @ Assault Vest
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Power Gem
- Poison Jab
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Thunderbolt

Tyranitar (M) @ Assault Vest
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 240 HP / 16 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Pursuit
- Dark Pulse
- Earthquake
- Ice Beam

Ferrothorn (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Iron Barbs
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Relaxed Nature
- Giga Drain
- Thunder Wave
- Knock Off
- Stealth Rock

Araquanid (M) @ Assault Vest
Ability: Water Bubble
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpD / 8 Spe
Calm Nature
- Surf
- Liquidation
- Leech Life
- Ice Beam


In the last match I replaced Araquanid with Hippowdon and it was my downfall XD
 

Voting for no ban. At first I didn't have a strong opinion on Araquanid, but after laddering for a while I decided that it shouldn't be banned. Araquanid is a great wallbreaker and has amazing special bulk, but other than that it doesn't have a lot going for it. While Araquanid can ohko most of the metagame it has problems finding a chance to attack. It struggles against offense because of it's low physical bulk and how almost everything in the tier is mixed. Even bulky offense is a problem for Araquanid because most of the metagame outspeeds it. I had Araquanid on the team I've been using to get on top of the ladder, but in most games it just ended up being a sac because of how difficult it is for Araquanid to get a chance to attack. It has been useful against some TR teams but other than that it's been either dead weight or just a decent pivot. Since most of the teams are either offense or bulky offense it won't be a huge problem for the opponent to sac something if Araquanid manages to get a chance to attack. I think that there are bigger problems than Araquanid in the metagame right now. Fuck, I even think that something like Sylveon is more broken than Araquanid and that thing is nowhere near deserving a suspect.
 
Have you guys tried Celesteela? I think it is super fun to use:

Celesteela @ Flyinium Z / Leftovers
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Autotomize
- Air Slash
- Heavy Slam / Iron Head
- Fire Blast

You would need a lot of boosts and Floatzel/Raichu-Alola to not be scarfed for you to be able to outspeed them, but if there's no weather abuser left, this can be pretty deadly. After each kill it gets faster and, consequently, stronger, and max HP already grants it very good bulk, outside of its exceptional typing, giving you resitance to common priority in Fake Out and Sylveon's Quick Attack. You're still super fat after Autotomize, so I don't think you need to run Iron Head, but idk, maybe it's better. Also, I chose Fire Blast>Flamethrower 'cause +2 252+ SpA Celesteela Flamethrower vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Metagross-Mega: 246-290 (81.7 - 96.3%). Here are some replays:

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7fullpotential-543353187
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7fullpotential-543355927
 

cityscapes

Take care of yourself.
is a Tiering Contributoris a Community Contributor Alumnus
here's some sets

Cryogonal @ Assault Vest
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Careful Nature
- Freeze-Dry
- Knock Off
- Explosion
- Rapid Spin

vestflake. sort of outclassed by claydol i guess but it has its moments if only because freeze-dry is so good. ttar tries to trap you with pursuit but you can just boom and beat it after sr


Metagross @ Metagrossite
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Bold Nature
- Iron Defense
- Shadow Ball
- Bullet Punch
- Brick Break

meatgross. this thing is really good in general but it has a tendency to lose to broken stuff like raichu-a if bp doesn't ko. these last two moves are here to hit steels and stuff like slowbro/doublade. pairs well with stuff that can handle weather, hazard stacking helps too

weather is dumb
electric terrain is dumb
accelgor is insane
eviolite ghosts should die
everything else seems ok
 

SaturnZelda

formerly TylerWithNumbers
here's some sets

Cryogonal @ Assault Vest
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Careful Nature
- Freeze-Dry
- Knock Off
- Explosion
- Rapid Spin

vestflake. sort of outclassed by claydol i guess but it has its moments if only because freeze-dry is so good. ttar tries to trap you with pursuit but you can just boom and beat it after sr


Metagross @ Metagrossite
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Bold Nature
- Iron Defense
- Shadow Ball
- Bullet Punch
- Brick Break

meatgross. this thing is really good in general but it has a tendency to lose to broken stuff like raichu-a if bp doesn't ko. these last two moves are here to hit steels and stuff like slowbro/doublade. pairs well with stuff that can handle weather, hazard stacking helps too

weather is dumb
electric terrain is dumb
accelgor is insane
eviolite ghosts should die
everything else seems ok
Run Tapu Lele and all of your problems will be solved imo
 

SaturnZelda

formerly TylerWithNumbers
This also has a perk of blocking priority which Unburden mons and Alolachu hate.
Yeah, although Accelgor can just OHKO you with Leech Life and then there's nothing to stop it from sweeping, because priority is blocked on both sides of the field.
 
On paper, this meta seems really fun, but in practice, Full Potential ironically doesn't have that much potential. With few exceptions, the entire Meta forces you to use extremely bulky mixed walls or Pokemon that are faster than the Flash. With everything in this meta having such high psuedo stats and BSTs, it really begs the question why this is an OU meta instead of an Ubers meta (or at least have several Ubers Pokemon unbanned).

Aside from a few Pokemon (Blaziken/Mega, and possibly Lugia, Deoxys-S/D, Mega Mewtwo-X/Y, The Primals), the Ubers family seems to fit in with the Full Potential family pretty well. And thinking about it, it would help balance the Meta significantly.

Considering what Full Potential offers, something like Giratina wouldn't be broken, if not needed to deal with major threats in this Meta, but namely Giratina. Most of these Ubermons may be less lucky with their highest stats and would be powerful, they would still be useful due to their typings. Adding such Pokemon would also allow us to experiment more too. It really seems like they do need to come in to fix this meta. Hell, as controversial as it may seem, Mega Rayquaza might be balanced in this meta (Unless Draco Meteor and its other counterparts are still unbanned somehow).

An alternative would to be unbanning certain Pokemon.

If this meta doesn't change to an Ubers based Meta, what should be unbanned?
 
On paper, this meta seems really fun, but in practice, Full Potential ironically doesn't have that much potential. With few exceptions, the entire Meta forces you to use extremely bulky mixed walls or Pokemon that are faster than the Flash. With everything in this meta having such high psuedo stats and BSTs, it really begs the question why this is an OU meta instead of an Ubers meta (or at least have several Ubers Pokemon unbanned).

Aside from a few Pokemon (Blaziken/Mega, and possibly Lugia, Deoxys-S/D, Mega Mewtwo-X/Y, The Primals), the Ubers family seems to fit in with the Full Potential family pretty well. And thinking about it, it would help balance the Meta significantly.

Considering what Full Potential offers, something like Giratina wouldn't be broken, if not needed to deal with major threats in this Meta, but namely Giratina. Most of these Ubermons may be less lucky with their highest stats and would be powerful, they would still be useful due to their typings. Adding such Pokemon would also allow us to experiment more too. It really seems like they do need to come in to fix this meta. Hell, as controversial as it may seem, Mega Rayquaza might be balanced in this meta (Unless Draco Meteor and its other counterparts are still unbanned somehow).

An alternative would to be unbanning certain Pokemon.

If this meta doesn't change to an Ubers based Meta, what should be unbanned?
There's a lot of potential in this meta, I'm sorry you don't see it. Maybe someday Ubers will be allowed, but for a meta just out of the gate, I think it's being done wisely. In the end, coming on here to criticise it doesn't show a lot of respect for it's creators. Maybe talk to them instead?

In other news, I'm finding priority to be quite helpful in this meta. Kecleon does a lot of damage real easily, and he's often an MVP of my teams. He's also been useful in surprising opponents with his power. I've seen people forfeit because they couldn't figure out how to take it on.

Also, hitmontop is looking to be much the same in usefulness. For a meta full of things with high speed, it can help sometimes. But keep in mind when facing a team with mons like raichu-alola that have extremespeed that they will have faster priority. But if you use Kecleon, you can try and keep with shadow sneak in order to prevent them from using it on you.
 

Ivy

resident enigma
is a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Smogon Discord Contributor
This would probably be a pain to code, but, could foul play be made to take into account the highest stat in the same way attacks normally do?
 
There's a lot of potential in this meta
While I agree with that statement, I also agree with his that teambulding really stagnated around extreme bulk and speed. I've seen people using weather in a team that doesn't benefit them in the least, if only to stop a potential rain/sand sweep from the opposing side; I find myself using Tapu Fini for no other reason than to nullify somebody's potential Alolan Raichu, and though I haven't faced one in quite a while, I'm sure that I'll regret the decision to replace it the next time I bump into one. That, to me, is how limited teambuilding is right now.

In the end, coming on here to criticise it doesn't show a lot of respect for it's creators. Maybe talk to them instead?
Oh yeah? And what's the course of action, drop the matter and just go play other metas instead? Because, as far as "talking to the creators" go, that's exactly what he's trying to achieve, as I see it. There is wisdom behind his criticism and he hasn't even overextended his welcome by offending the creators or something.
 


Vote: DO NOT BAN

Reasoning: On paper, Araquanid is an absolute monster, sporting a 598 spd after assault vest with water boost makes it one of the hardest mons on switch-in. However, those who have played extensively know all too well that speed kills and the same applies in this case. Araq's lack of priority coupled with it's mediocre def, basically turns him into fodder against the likes of accelgor and the multitude of fast nukes. Maybe he's better under trick room and possibly in the future if/when speed abuse is nerf; however with the current meta, Araquanid doesn't particularly stand out and the concept of water boost is more alarming than it actually is.

 

nv

The Lost Age
is a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Staff Alumnus
ANNOUNCEMENT!!!

Ok so this has been in wait for awhile now (and quite a few of the room regulars know this as well, but I haven't had time to post until today). I have noticed that a lot of people have been complaining about Speed abuse in general via weather-based abilities, Unburden, and so on. While this as a general issue can't be nerfed all at once i.e. someone suggesting Speed be in the same vein as HP and thus not be "calculated" into the HRS I do believe that there are specific issues we as a group can tackle to dampen the "overcentralization" on Speed. For this reason, the council decided that the first step towards this was to quickban Unburden. This ability in particular is what has caused Accelgor (and others) to become such a huge problem for many teams and while there are ways to counteract Alolachu and weather abusers albeit inconsistently, there is no way to get rid of Unburden's boost unless you can somehow force it out, which is hard to do whenever the Unburden users are not only very fast, but very powerful as well. This isn't the only issue, but the council and I are deciding on how we will take care of weather abusers + Alolachu as they are a "more delicate issue" than the ability, Unburden.

Next up, with the obvious development of the metagame as OMotM, there has been a distinct notice of "item spam" on certain teams. While most of the high ladder players don't feel this is a problem, a lot of item spam teams are mindless and can cause a lack of diversity (especially with the centralization around Speed abuse at the moment), the council and I decided to implement the Item Clause.
  • Item Clause: No two Pokémon may hold the same item.
While this may seem like a bit of an "oddball" clause, it will add some diversity to the meta as it will make sure we avoid the item spam teams that have littered the ladder as well as maybe help diversify the teambuilding.

To end this on a bit of a lighter note, I wanna showcase a Pokemon I have been having a ton of fun with in Full Potential and that is...

Latias @ Soul Dew
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Draco Meteor
- Psyshock
- Defog
- Healing Wish / Roost

Latias has been a fantastic offensive support Pokemon that I have been using on quite a few of my teams. Healing Wish support is so fantastic in this metagame thanks to being able to heal up your threats that tend to wear themselves down since a lot of Pokemon tend to run Choice Scarf, Assault Vest, or Eviolite and as such lack a form of passive recovery. Latias also has the unique ability to run an item that is unique to itself (and thus can fit on post-Item Clause teams) as Soul Dew boosts its STAB moves, making Draco Meteor an even better nuking move. Defog is also really nice since the meta is so offensive and SR can wear down / cripple a lot of Pokemon so getting rid of them can help your team edge out over the opponent.

Either way, I hope you guys are enjoying the meta and stay tuned for more on how to fix the Speed abuse problem and continue laddering for the Araquanid suspect. :)

EDIT: Hopefully The Immortal sees this :x
 

Ludicrousity

You humour me greatly with your arrogance and c...
is a Forum Moderator Alumnus
so, I was just messing about, and I though to myself, I wonder if Registeel would work...

This is what came out of it: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7fullpotential-544590653



Registeel @ Chesto Berry
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD OR 4 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD
Bold Nature
- Amnesia
- Flash Cannon
- Earthquake
- Rest

So the way that this works is, you take hits first because Registeel is fat, and set up 1-2 amnesias (3 if you catch the foe off guard). From there, proceed to sweep the foe with a massive SpD of 1348-1596. Defence stays high thanks to 252 and bold, so this thing becomes a real pain to take out, although Physical attacks can wear it down,
 
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nv

The Lost Age
is a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Staff Alumnus
Ok to put this train back on its track, it is time for another...

ANNOUNCEMENT!!!

So, to further address the Speed Abuse problem this metagame has ended up having, I have went ahead and decided to quickban Speed Boosting weather abilities. This includes Swift Swim, Chlorophyll, Slush Rush, and Sand Rush as the affected abilities. The Immortal gave us permission to deal with this problem in a blanket way rather than banning the abusers as it has been proven these abilities cause way too many problems as they are essentially giving a Huge Power boost alongside their original effects. The council and I have also went ahead and quickbanned Alolan Raichu. This Pokemon has been the bane of many teams as, with Electro Ball, it had a horribly powerful STAB that was consistently at 150 BP with 100% accuracy as well as the ability to run whatever coverage it needed (Grass Knot for Ground-type Pokemon, etc.) Furthermore, Alolan Raichu has its own priority in ExtremeSpeed which means that priority users themselves are going to be outsped and therefore cannot revenge kill it.

Hopefully these quickbans will help to shape the metagame to be a better, creative, and more diverse environment as Speed Abuse is going to be hard to do whenever their means of power have been banned. Now to add another set because apparently that is a thing I do whenever I make announcements :P


Toxapex @ Black Sludge
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Poison Jab
- Recover
- Haze

I have been using Toxapex a bit moreso with the new quickbans (since the council + close friends have known of this for a couple of days now) and it makes a rly good stop to setup sweepers thanks to Haze, Regenerator, and Recover. Its typing does leave it weak to Tapu Koko, but it can stop a few key threats hard such as Accelgor, Mega Metagross without Earthquake, and so on. It being so slow does suck since it is forced to take a hit, but with Regenerator it has quite a bit of staying power to last throughout a match.

Anyways, I hope you guys enjoy the new quickbans and just so you guys know, a Viability Rankings is currently being worked on so expect a very cool post by the wonderful Funbot28 :)
 

drampa's grandpa

cannonball
is a Community Contributoris a Community Leader Alumnus
So now that the speed-boosting abilities are gone (rip Slush Rush you were overshadowed everywhere but in my heart) everyone will be scrambling around looking for alternative sweepers... Well Swellow is a mon that has already come up, on the first page in fact, but I'm here to present a set I call "alt-Accelgor."

wurd burd (Swellow) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Scrappy
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Boomburst
- Quick Attack (/Heat Wave/U-Turn/Endeavor/Toxic/Counter)
- Agility
- Reversal


This set imitates Accelgors old Sash Unburden sets, just without the Unburden part. Now there are of course faster things you could do this with, for instance Ninjask, but what sets apart Swellow is its access to powerful 2 move perfect coverage in Boomburst and Reversal. The idea is to get it in undamaged, set up an Agility as something brings you down to sash, then spam Boomburst or Reversal (which hits 200 base power at 1 hp, or just under Boombursts power) until you die. Quick Attack is there to try to kill things that have +1 priority, but it's disappointingly weak so you might want to consider swapping it out for something else... maybe Heat Wave for Scizor, U-Turn for momentum pre-set up, Endeavor to break a wall for something else to sweep, Counter to kill the thing that gets you down to sash (NOT COMPATIBLE WITH SCRAPPY), or Toxic to cripple a wall before you die.

Swellow appreciates support from allies that can clear hazards and set them, and works much better when the opposing team is well worn down. Do NOT expect this brid to OHKO everything the way Accelgor, Raichu, and co. did, because it is not in their league (and hence not banned like them).

Other sets that work are the scarf set that was posted on the first page... and probably not much else. Maybe a Guts set but honestly why would you when better things exist for that?
 

SaturnZelda

formerly TylerWithNumbers
R.I.P Raichu, you will be missed. Anyways, now that they're banned, I think we'll see less AV T-Tars, so I don't think I need to run Mach Punch over Vacuum Wave anymore.
 

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