GRAMMAR DOJO: see post #61

[P Squared]

old paragraph with checks

Start off by setting up entry hazards if and when (1) possible, as this will apply some pressure to the opponent (2), causing them to think more carefully about switching in and out, and. (3) If there is no chance to set up hazards at first, start off with Protect to scout out the opponent's moves. Take full advantage of this to help in determining what moves the opponent could have and and determine what you can do to counter it (4). Set up a Leech Seed after hazards have been set up (5) and follow it up with Protect. This will help Ferroseed remain in control of the matchup, not only receiving restoring its HP each turn but also slowly wearing down opposing Pokemon (6). As opponents will attempt to switch, being able to determine switch-ins is key for Ferroseed since as it can use Leech Seed on an incoming opponent to wear them it down or Gyro Ball for damage. Use Gyro Ball after Protect to make sure Ferroseed recovers from any damage taken. (7) Thunder Wave can also be used when opponents switch in to slow them down for setup sweepers. However, it's worth noting that Thunder Wave is somewhat counterproductive with to Gyro Ball, so always think carefully about when to utilize both. Being able to predict Poison-type moves is useful, as Ferroseed can be tossed into play switched in, saving teammates such as Slurpuff, Lilligant, or even (8) Granbull from danger.

explanations

1. 'Start off' implies that Ferroseed will be trying to set up hazards immediately, so including 'and when' seems unnecessary.
2. Just saying 'pressure' is more straightforward.
3. Split the sentence here because it felt like a natural place to stop.
4. The crossed out part basically restated what the previous sentence said about scouting, so it was removed. The remaining part of the crossed out sentence was fine and flowed well with the scouting sentence, so I put them together.
5. This one wasn't important, but 'up' was used three times in that sentence and it felt awkward.
6. I took 'this' to refer to the Leech Seed + Protect combo. In that case, 'Leech Seed not only restores its HP each turn' makes more sense than 'Leech Seed not only receives HP each turn'.
7. It sounds like Gyro Ball is helping Ferroseed recover from damage, which isn't right. It doesn't seem like a vital sentence anyways, so I took it out.
8. Unfortunately for Granbull, it isn't so special that it deserves an 'even' before its name.

new paragraph

Start off by setting up entry hazards if possible, as this will pressure the opponent, causing them to think more carefully about switching in and out. If there is no chance to set up hazards, start off with Protect to scout out the opponent's moves and determine what you can do to counter it. Set up a Leech Seed after hazards have been set and follow it up with Protect. This will help Ferroseed remain in control of the matchup, not only restoring its HP each turn but also slowly wearing down opposing Pokemon. As opponents will attempt to switch, being able to determine switch-ins is key for Ferroseed as it can use Leech Seed on an incoming opponent to wear it down or Gyro Ball for damage. Thunder Wave can also be used when opponents switch in to slow them down for setup sweepers. However, it's worth noting that Thunder Wave is somewhat counterproductive to Gyro Ball, so think carefully about when to utilize both. Being able to predict Poison-type moves is useful, as Ferroseed can be switched in, saving teammates such as Slurpuff, Lilligant, or Granbull from danger.

 

[Calm Pokemaster]

Original

Start off by setting up entry hazards if and when possible, as this will apply some pressure to the opponent, causing them to think more carefully about switching in and out, and if there is no chance to set up hazards at first, start off with Protect to scout out the opponent's moves. Take full advantage of this to help in determining what moves the opponent could have and what you can do to counter it. Set up a Leech Seed after hazards have been set up and follow it up with Protect. This will help Ferroseed remain in control of the matchup; not only receiving HP each turn but also slowly wearing down opposing Pokemon. Opponents will attempt to switch, being able to determine switch-ins is key for Ferroseed since it can use Leech Seed on an incoming opponent to wear them down or Gyro Ball for damage. Use Gyro Ball after Protect to make sure Ferroseed recovers from any damage taken. Thunder Wave can also be used when opponents switch in to slow them down for setup sweepers. However, it's worth noting that Thunder Wave is somewhat counterproductive with Gyro Ball, so always think about when to utilize both. Being able to predict poison moves is useful, as Ferroseed can be tossed into play, saving teammates such as Slurpuff, Lilligant, or even Granbull from danger.

Changes

Start off by setting up entry hazards if and when possible, as this will apply some pressure to the opponent, causing them to think more carefully about make the opponent think twice before switching Pokemon in and out (1); if not, and if there is no chance to set up hazards at first, start off with Protect to scout out the opponent's move with Protect. (2) Take full advantage of this to help in determining This will help you determine what moves the opponent could have and what you can do to counter it (3). Set up a Leech Seed after hazards have been set up and follow it up with Protect again. This will help let Ferroseed remain in control of the matchup; it will not only receiving recover some HP each turn but also slowly wear down opposing Pokemon. (4) Opponents will attempt to switch, being able to determine switch-ins is key for Ferroseed since it can use Leech Seed on an incoming opponent to wear them down or Gyro Ball for damage Prediction is key here: Ferroseed can potentially deal heavy damage with Gyro Ball to a switch-in expecting Leech Seed. (5) Use Gyro Ball after Protect to make sure Ferroseed recovers from any damage taken. (6) Thunder Wave can also be used when opponents switch in to slow them down a fast switch-in for setup sweepers, However, it's worth noting that Thunder Wave though it (7) is somewhat counterproductive with Gyro Ball, so always think about when to utilize both. (8) Being able to predict poison moves is useful, as Ferroseed can be tossed into play, saving teammates such as Slurpuff, Lilligant, or even Granbull from danger In general, Ferroseed is ideally brought in on Poison moves aimed at a teammate such as Slurpuff, Lilligant, or Granbull. (9)

Copy-paste

Start off by setting up entry hazards if possible, as this will make the opponent think twice before switching Pokemon in and out; if not, scout the opponent's move with Protect. This will help you determine what moves the opponent could have and what you can do to counter it. Set up a Leech Seed after hazards have been set up and follow it up with Protect again. This will let Ferroseed remain in control of the matchup; it will not only recover some HP each turn but also slowly wear down opposing Pokemon. Prediction is key here: Ferroseed can potentially deal heavy damage with Gyro Ball to a switch-in expecting Leech Seed. Thunder Wave can also be used to slow down a fast switch-in for setup sweepers, though it is somewhat counterproductive with Gyro Ball. In general, Ferroseed is ideally brought in on Poison moves aimed at a teammate such as Slurpuff, Lilligant, or Granbull.

Explanations

1. The sentence talks about how Ferrosed should set up entry hazards at the beginning only if possible. 'and when' is thus incorrect here. Secondly, we can do without all the fluff in the latter part of the sentence about pressuring the opponent: condensing it into a shorter phrase is all I did.
2. "if not" will suffice; you don't need to repeat the stuff about not having a chance to set up hazards. Similarly, to avoid repetition of "start off with", shift the "with Protect" to the end of the sentence.
3. "Take full advantage of this to help in determining" is the epitome of fluff. Replace it with the far simpler "This will help you determine".
4. "help" --> "let" since you already used "help" in the previous sentence. The error with tense should be obvious enough; "receive" --> "recover" because "receiving HP" sounds awkward.
5. Some messy prose here. Emphasize the importance of prediction when using Ferroseed, as well as the surprise value of Gyro Ball against switch-ins expecting Leech Seed.
6. This is a poorly written sentence that is better off being removed. It makes it sound as tough Gyro Ball gives Ferroseed passive recovery.
7. Slowing down opponents switch in isn't important; it's hitting fast attackers that is crucial, and this should be mentioned. Also, linking this part with how it's counterproductive with Gyro Ball is easily achieved with just "though" instead of a new sentence.
8. Redundant. The contrast between the two moves is adequately expressed with "though".
9. Some awkward, informal prose here (e.g., "tossed into play") that the correction tightens up. Also, "Poison" should be capitalized to avoid confusion with the status.

The Dutch Plumberjack Please go through this wonderful article from Grammar Girl for clarification on the differences between 'because', 'since', and 'as'.

As always, I'll give you folks a few days to get your doubts clarified.

 

[Calm Pokemaster]

Here's your next paragraph:

Hide

Teammates like Garbodor are great for Carracosta. Unlike Ferroseed, Garbodor isn't complete set-up bait and can utilize Spikes and Toxic Spikes and also cover Grass-types fairly well. Dragalge is a strong partner as it forms a good core with Carracosta due to their nice defensive synergy synergy. Carracosta resists Ice-type moves, while Dragalge can tank special attacks for Carracosta. Dragalge also has an easy time dealing with Grass-types. Elecitvire can be great as well, boosting its Speed with any Volt Switch users or Thunder Wave users. Offensive sweepers, such as Swords Dance Feraligatr and Lilligant, are great partners as Carracosta benefits from their typings. Typhlosion is also a great partner for dealing with Grass-types. Carracosta can shield it from strong Water-types while it removes special Grass-types. Choice Band Torterra is a great teammate as it not resists Ground-type moves, but also hits like a truck. Mesprit also works as a great partner because of its bulkiness. Carracosta can switch to Mesprit in case a Water- or Grass-type come into play, and it can proceed to neutralize both with Energy Ball and Hidden Power Fire respectively.

 

[Lumari]

wow i'm early for a change

Teammates like Garbodor are great for Carracosta. Unlike Ferroseed, Garbodor isn't complete set-up bait and can utilize Spikes and Toxic Spikes, and while also covering (1) Grass-types fairly well. Dragalge is a strong partner, (AC.2) as it forms a good core with Carracosta due to their nice defensive synergy (3) synergy. Carracosta resists Ice-type moves, while Dragalge can tank special attacks for Carracosta. Dragalge also has an easy time dealing with Grass-types. Elecitvire Electivire (3) can be a great partner (4) as well, boosting its Speed with any by absorbing Volt Switch users or Thunder Wave users (5). Offensive sweepers, such as Swords Dance Feraligatr and Lilligant, are great partners, (AC.2) as Carracosta benefits from their typings. Typhlosion is also a great partner for dealing with Grass-types. Carracosta can shield it from strong Water-types, (AC) while it removes special Grass-types. Choice Band Torterra is a great teammate, (AC.2) as it not only (6) resists Ground-type moves, but also hits like a truck. Mesprit also works as a great partner because of its bulkiness bulk (7). Carracosta can switch to Mesprit in case a Water- or Grass-type comes (8) into play, and it can proceed to neutralize both with Energy Ball and Hidden Power Fire respectively.

explanations

(1) messy prose, too much parataxis; cleaned up by swapping in a participle
(2) comma before 'as' in case of distinct clauses
(3) typos
(4) i think the prose really benefits from adding a noun here, electivire isn't just 'great' for this set (too generic), he's 'a great partner'.
(5) inappropriate preposition here, i couldn't think up a more appropriate one ( -.- ) so i circumvented it a little
(6) torterra does resist ground-type moves, a coordinating word was missing ^_^
(7) i don't think 'bulkiness' is a word, looks rather engrish... in any case i see no reason why simply 'bulk' would be inappropriate here.
(8) subject-verb disagreement (unless 'in case' can take a subjunctive, but as far as i'm aware it can't)

FOLLOW-UP QUESTION - hidden because I don't know if it's appropriate to leave this in plain sight

Also, I once again have a follow-up question, this time about the 'like' vs 'such as' thing. From what I've heard, 'such as' only states dry-cut examples, whereas 'like' rather means 'in the vein of'. That's why I left 'like' in the first line untouched here; the writer means 'teammates in the vein of/comparable to Garbodor' ', whereas using 'such as' simply would have stated 'Garbodor is an example from the category 'teammates', which would be way too generic - it would basically include any NU Pokemon. (If the text had said 'hazard setters' rather than 'teammates', I would have changed it to 'such as' in a heartbeat.) I'm also asking this because I ran into something similar while amchecking NU Ariados yesterday - I actually changed 'such as' to 'like' here (dw, I provided reasoning and stated I wasn't quite sure). The sentence said something like 'Pokemon such as Uxie are hit hard by Megahorn'; I changed this to 'like', because judging by the rules for 'like' and 'such as' as I know them, the use of the latter would imply that basically anything from the category 'Pokemon' would be a valid example here, including stuff like Tauros and Dragalge, which obviously is inappropriate, judging by the context.
I found this grammar girl article online during this dojo check, which stated that 'such as' is more directly inclusive; it also more or less confirmed my notion of 'like' meaning 'in the vein of'. However, some of the examples in this article still somewhat contradicted the rules of 'like' and 'such as' as I know them, so I still don't get it 100%.
My most urgent question right now is whether or not 'like' is appropriate with generic categories like (heh) 'Pokemon' and 'teammates', because I really think 'such as' is too direct here, and it kind of goes against my intuition :)

 

[frenzyplant]

original

Teammates like Garbodor are great for Carracosta. Unlike Ferroseed, Garbodor isn't complete set-up bait and can utilize Spikes and Toxic Spikes and also cover Grass-types fairly well. Dragalge is a strong partner as it forms a good core with Carracosta due to their nice defensive synergy synergy. Carracosta resists Ice-type moves, while Dragalge can tank special attacks for Carracosta. Dragalge also has an easy time dealing with Grass-types. Elecitvire can be great as well, boosting its Speed with any Volt Switch users or Thunder Wave users. Offensive sweepers, such as Swords Dance Feraligatr and Lilligant, are great partners as Carracosta benefits from their typings. Typhlosion is also a great partner for dealing with Grass-types. Carracosta can shield it from strong Water-types while it removes special Grass-types. Choice Band Torterra is a great teammate as it not resists Ground-type moves, but also hits like a truck. Mesprit also works as a great partner because of its bulkiness. Carracosta can switch to Mesprit in case a Water- or Grass-type come into play, and it can proceed to neutralize both with Energy Ball and Hidden Power Fire respectively.

check

add remove (comments)

Teammates that can cover Grass-types, like such as 1 Garbodor, Dragalge, and Typhlosion 2, are great for Carracosta. Unlike Ferroseed, (is there some context here I'm missing? 3) Garbodor isn't complete setup (remove dash) 4 bait and can utilize Spikes and Toxic Spikes as and also cover Grass-types fairly 5 well. Dragalge is a strong partner as it 6 forms a good core with Carracosta due to their nice defensive synergy 7 synergy, as Carracosta resists Ice-type moves for Dragalge, which Carracosta resists Ice-type moves, while Dragalge 8 can tank special attacks for Carracosta. Dragalge also has an easy time dealing with Grass-types. 9 Carracosta takes strong Water-types for Typhlosion, while Typhlosion removes special Grass-types. 10a Electivire can be a great partner 11 as well, taking Electric-type attacks aimed at Carracosta to boosting its Speed with any Volt Switch users or Thunder Wave users 12. Offensive sweepers, such as 13 Swords Dance Feraligatr and Lilligant, (remove comma) are great partners as Carracosta benefits from their typings. Typhlosion is also a great partner for dealing with Grass-types. Carracosta can shield it from strong Water-types while it removes special Grass-types. 10b Choice Band Torterra is a great teammate as it not only 14a resists Ground-type moves, (remove comma) 14b but also hits like a truck. Mesprit also works as a great partner because of its bulkiness. and the fact that Carracosta can switch to Mesprit in case a Water- or Grass-type come into play, and it can proceed to neutralize both Water-types and Grass-types 15 with Energy Ball and Hidden Power Fire respectively.

explanations

1. Characterize the teammates that are great for Carracosta before changing the "like" to "such as".
2. Add examples of such teammates from later in the paragraph, which is somewhat disjointed.
3. Ferroseed has never been mentioned and is never mentioned again.
4. "setup", not "set-up".
5. Already characterized Garbodor as this in change 1.
6. Mostly unnecessary.
7. "synergy" is repeated.
8. Combine the sentences to keep with the one-sentence-per-mentioned-teammate-that-can-cover-Grass-types (ospmttccgt) rule. Don't change much of the wording.
9. Already characterized Dragalge as this in change 1.
10a,b. Move the information from 10b up. By condensing this information into one sentence, ospmttccgt is followed and the flow of the paragraph is improved.
11. "Electivire" is misspelled, and "great" is vague.
12. Motor Drive's effects have no bearing on Electivire being a great partner.
13. Carracosta isn't benefited by all offensive sweepers' typings.
14a,b. Not only, but also. The comma in this case does nothing to improve the flow and is unnecessary.
15. Give the awkward sentence a facelift. Bulkiness is a word but not accepted for these purposes. Respectively requires and.

copypaste

Teammates that can cover Grass-types, such as Garbodor, Dragalge, and Typhlosion, are great for Carracosta. Garbodor isn't complete setup bait and can utilize Spikes and Toxic Spikes as well. Dragalge forms a good core with Carracosta due to their nice defensive synergy, as Carracosta resists Ice-type moves for Dragalge, which can tank special attacks for Carracosta. Carracosta takes strong Water-types for Typhlosion, while Typhlosion removes special Grass-types. Electivire can be a great partner as well, taking Electric-types aimed at Carracosta to boost its Speed. Swords Dance Feraligatr and Lilligant are great partners as Carracosta benefits from their typings. Choice Band Torterra is a great teammate as it not only resists Ground-type moves but also hits like a truck. Mesprit also works as a great partner because of its bulk and the fact that it can neutralize Water-types and Grass-types with Energy Ball and Hidden Power Fire respectively.

 

[Ender]

I'll be posting an answer key in the next day, so anyone else who wants to try should do so soon!

You have until some time tomorrow

 

[Ender]

Answer key is up! I did things a bit differently this time, so please let me know what you think of the format (if no one likes it, I'll go back to the standard format). Remember that everyone makes different changes and sometimes one change is as correct as another, so keep that in mind as you read through this. The purpose of this key is to explain the thought processes behind changes. If the thought process is correct, the changes will likely be good.

Thank you to our participants! As always, let me know if you have questions!

Changes and Explanations

Teammates like Garbodor and Dragalge have great synergy with are great for Carracosta.

The next couple Pokemon generally talk about type synergy, so I added that to this sentence to make it more clear. It's not necessary to list all the Pokemon we'll be talking about in this category, but you can if you want. I wouldn't list only one though.

Edit: like is correct here

Unlike Ferroseed, Garbodor isn't complete setup bait and can utilize Spikes and Toxic Spikes. [period] It can and also cover Grass-types fairly well.

I split this sentence into two because the multiple "and"s made it convoluted. "Setup" is the proper form of the word in this case because it isn't being used as a verb (where "set up" would be proper). This word is never hyphenated. I'm assuming the Ferroseed mention refers to an earlier paragraph in the same section, so I left it.

Dragalge is a strong partner, [comma] as it forms a good core with Carracosta due to their nice defensive synergy synergy; [period changed to semicolon]

Always a comma before "as" when it links two independent clauses. However, we can actually improve the sentence by deleting this part, making the comma a nonissue (I wanted to point it out, though, because it's a common mistake). Synergy was written twice accidentally. Finally, because the next sentence is subordinate to this one, I changed the period to a semicolon.

Carracosta resists Ice-type moves, while Dragalge can tanks special attacks for Carracosta.

Explanation of the previous sentence. I made it so that verb forms are parallel.

Dragalge also has an easy time dealing with Grass-types.

Looks okay to me.

Alternatively, Typhlosion is also a great partner for dealing with Grass-types, while Carracosta can shield it from strong Water-types.

Moved these sentences up from below because they fit better here where we're talking about Grass resists. I added "alternatively" because it presents a different option over Dragalge for a similar purpose.

Electivire can be great as well, boosting can boost its Speed by taking Electric-type attacks aimed at Carracosta. with any Volt Switch users or Thunder Wave users.

Electivire was spelled incorrectly. There are a lot of ways to deal with this sentence to make it more clear, so my way definitely isn't the only one. As long as you somehow addressed this, you're probably fine.

Offensive sweepers, such as Swords Dance Feraligatr and Lilligant [removed comma] are great partners, [comma] as Carracosta benefits from their typings.

The first part doesn't do anything but make the sentence more convoluted. This means that the comma after Lilligant is unnecessary. A comma before "as" is needed because it separates two independent clauses.

Typhlosion is also a great partner for dealing with Grass-types. Carracosta can shield it from strong Water-types while it removes special Grass-types.

Moved this to earlier in the paragraph where it fits better.

Choice Band Torterra is a great teammate as it not only resists Ground-type moves that Carracosta is weak to, but also hits like a truck.

Obviously CB Torterra is a great teammate or it wouldn't be listed here. When you have "but also" you also need "not only". Mentioning that CB Torterra is good because it resists Ground is out of place unless you also mention why this fact is relevant; in this case, it's because Carracosta is weak to Ground.

Mesprit's [apostrophe] bulk also makes it a great partner; [semicolon] also works as a great partner because of its bulkiness.

I revised this sentence so it works better with the following one. It's not absolutely necessary to make this revision, so don't fret if you did something different. Semicolon because the next sentence is subordinate to this one.

Carracosta can switch to Mesprit in case a Water- or Grass-type comes into play, and Mesprit it can proceed to neutralize either both with Energy Ball and or Hidden Power Fire, [comma] respectively.

You need a verb here so I used "comes". The "it" is ambiguous, so it needs to be changed to an actual noun. Because only one is coming into play, "either" is more correct than "both". For the same reason, "or" over "and". Finally, comma before "respectively".

 

[Lumari]

Ender could you please elaborate a little more on the 'like' vs. 'such as' thing? I don't like rules that 'generally' apply, because that means I'll be doing it wrong in some cases :) and I've had some problems making the distinction between like and such as in recent checks.
From what I've heard, 'such as' only states dry-cut examples, whereas 'like' rather means 'in the vein of'. That's why I left 'like' in the first line untouched here; the writer means 'teammates in the vein of/comparable to Garbodor' ', whereas using 'such as' simply would have stated 'Garbodor is an example from the category 'teammates', which would be way too generic - it would basically include any NU Pokemon. I'm also asking this because I ran into something similar while amchecking NU Ariados some time ago - I actually changed 'such as' to 'like' here (dw, I provided reasoning and stated I wasn't quite sure). The sentence said something like 'Pokemon such as Uxie are hit hard by Megahorn'; I changed this to 'like', because judging by the rules for 'like' and 'such as' as I know them, the use of the latter would imply that basically anything from the category 'Pokemon' would be a valid example here, including stuff like Tauros and Dragalge, which obviously is inappropriate, judging by the context.
I found this grammar girl article online during this dojo check, which stated that 'such as' is more directly inclusive; it also more or less confirmed my notion of 'like' meaning 'in the vein of'. However, some of the examples in this article still somewhat contradicted the rules of 'like' and 'such as' as I know them, so I still don't get it 100%.
My most urgent question right now is whether or not 'like' is appropriate with generic categories like (heh) 'Pokemon' and 'teammates', because I really think 'such as' is too direct here, and it kind of goes against my intuition :) I'd also be happy with some sample sentences that clearly show the difference (e.g. in the case of restrictive vs. non-restrictive clauses, something like 'I punished the boys who tend to be overly aggressive' - reasonable imo - vs. 'I punished the boys, who tend to be overly aggressive' - highly overgeneralising)

 

[Calm Pokemaster]

Ok, "Teammates like Garbodor and Dragalge" is actually correct (sorry Ender :/), because this part talks about teammates "like" Dragalge and Garbodor that have good type synergy with Carracosta.

In short, if one of "like" or "such as" would be more applicable, change it; if both sound equally fine, leave as is. In the example you provided about Uxie, both are perfectly fine: 'Uxie' belongs to a non-exhaustive list of examples that are hit hard by Megahorn. I know Grammar Girl says 'such as' is more inclusive, but I think we can assume that anyone who's reading the analysis knows that Uxie, though bulky, is hit hard only because it's weak to the move.

As for your query about restrictive and non-restrictive clauses, you practically answered the question yourself. If it is highly overgeneralizing, omit the comma; if not, leave it in.

As always, I'll give you folks some time to go through to Ender's explanations before I post the next paragraph.

 

[Ender]

^^ good to know. I changed it in the key.

 

[Calm Pokemaster]

Here's your next paragraph:

Hide

Substitute or Swords Dance can replace Fire Punch. The former will allow Cubone to take an incoming Will-O-Wisp, or Sucker Punch from Pawniard. The latter gives Cubone even more power, ensuring its switch ins don't survive the hit. If you're using either of these two options, it's recommended that you use Rock Slide for the third move slot for better coverage, and that you don't use these with Trick Room Cubone, as they will waste one of your sweeping turns. Bone Rush can be used over Bonemerang if you wish to comprehensively get past all Sturdy + Berry Juice users completely, although 2-3 hits from Bone Rush are always going to be less powerful than 2 hits from Bonemerang, leaving this option outclassed. Earthquake can replace Bonemerang if you wish to have more accuracy, although you will then be forgoing your ability to break through Substitute, Focus Sash, and Sturdy. Double-Edge can be used in conjunction with the ability Rock Head, replacing Fire Punch for a solid 120 Base Power move, unfortunately, this option does not have much coverage. Cubone can use Stealth Rock, but you're better off using Cubone's great power and coverage.

 

[Fourth Inversion]

Original

Substitute or Swords Dance can replace Fire Punch. The former will allow Cubone to take an incoming Will-O-Wisp, or Sucker Punch from Pawniard. The latter gives Cubone even more power, ensuring its switch ins don't survive the hit. If you're using either of these two options, it's recommended that you use Rock Slide for the third move slot for better coverage, and that you don't use these with Trick Room Cubone, as they will waste one of your sweeping turns. Bone Rush can be used over Bonemerang if you wish to comprehensively get past all Sturdy + Berry Juice users completely, although 2-3 hits from Bone Rush are always going to be less powerful than 2 hits from Bonemerang, leaving this option outclassed. Earthquake can replace Bonemerang if you wish to have more accuracy, although you will then be forgoing your ability to break through Substitute, Focus Sash, and Sturdy. Double-Edge can be used in conjunction with the ability Rock Head, replacing Fire Punch for a solid 120 Base Power move, unfortunately, this option does not have much coverage. Cubone can use Stealth Rock, but you're better off using Cubone's great power and coverage.

Check

Substitute or Swords Dance can replace Fire Punch. The former will allow Cubone to take an incoming Will-O-Wisp, or Sucker Punch from Pawniard. The latter gives Cubone even more power, ensuring its switch-ins(1) don't survive the hit. If you're using either of these two options, it's recommended that you use Rock Slide for the third move slot for better coverage, and that you don't use these with Cubone on a Trick Room Cuboneteam,(2) as they will waste one of your sweeping turns. Bone Rush can be used over Bonemerang if you wish to comprehensiveliably get past all Sturdy + Berry Juice users completely,(3) although 2-3 hits from Bone Rush are always going to be less powerful than 2 hits from Bonemerang, leaving this option outclassed. Earthquake can replace Bonemerang if you wish to have more accuracy, although you will then be forgoing your ability to break through Substitute, Focus Sash, and Sturdy. Double-Edge can be used over Fire Punch, and in conjunction with the ability Rock Head, replacing Fire Punch for is (4) a solid 120 Base Power move,; (5)unfortunately, this option does not havprovide (6) much coverage. Cubone can uset up (7)Stealth Rock, but you're better off using Cubone's great power and coverage.

Explanations

1. Switch ins -> Switch-ins. Standard Smogon formatting.
2. Reworded for clarity, as Trick Room Cubone might imply that Cubone actually learns Trick Room.
3. 'Comprehensively' and 'completely' in the same sentence is redundant, and 'reliably' is used to replace them, as it is a more accurate choice of word.
4. Reworded for improved sentence flow.
5. A semicolon is used instead of a comma, as this sentence is contrasting two different statements.
6. Provide is better, as the coverage that a move has differs between individual pokemon and sets.
7. Probably subjective, but I reworded this sentence to avoided 'use' and 'using' appearing twice.

Copy + Paste

Substitute or Swords Dance can replace Fire Punch. The former will allow Cubone to take an incoming Will-O-Wisp, or Sucker Punch from Pawniard. The latter gives Cubone even more power, ensuring its switch-ins don't survive the hit. If you're using either of these two options, it's recommended that you use Rock Slide for the third move slot for better coverage, and that you don't use these with Cubone on a Trick Room team, as they will waste one of your sweeping turns. Bone Rush can be used over Bonemerang if you wish to reliably get past all Sturdy + Berry Juice users, although 2-3 hits from Bone Rush are always going to be less powerful than 2 hits from Bonemerang, leaving this option outclassed. Earthquake can replace Bonemerang if you wish to have more accuracy, although you will then be forgoing your ability to break through Substitute, Focus Sash, and Sturdy. Double-Edge can be used over Fire Punch, and in conjunction with the ability Rock Head is a solid 120 Base Power move; unfortunately, this option does not provide much coverage. Cubone can set up Stealth Rock, but you're better off using Cubone's great power and coverage.

 

[Calm Pokemaster]

Hmm, a lukewarm response this time... in any case, I'll wait for another 24 hours before posting the answer.

 

[P Squared]

check

Substitute or Swords Dance can replace Fire Punch. The former will allow Cubone to take an incoming Will-O-Wisp, or Pawniard's Sucker Punch from Pawniard (1). The latter gives Cubone even more power, ensuring its switch-ins (2) don't survive the hit. If you're using either of these two options, it's recommended that you use Rock Slide for in the third moveslot (3) for better coverage, and that you don't use these with Trick Room Cubone, as they will waste one of your sweeping turns. Bone Rush can be used over Bonemerang if you wish to comprehensively get past all Sturdy + Berry Juice users completely, although 2-3 hits from Bone Rush are always going to be less powerful than 2 two hits from Bonemerang (4), leaving this option outclassed. Earthquake can replace Bonemerang if you wish to have more accuracy, although you will then be forgoing your ability to break through Substitute, Focus Sash, and Sturdy. Double-Edge can be used in conjunction with the ability Rock Head, replacing Fire Punch for with a solid 120 Base Power move,; (5) unfortunately, this option does not provide have much coverage. Cubone can use Stealth Rock, but you're better off using Cubone's great power and coverage.

explanations

1. Took out the comma, but then it sounds like Pawniard is using Will-O-Wisp, so I moved Pawniard before Sucker Punch. Is Pawniard the only user of Sucker Punch in LC or something, though? Otherwise I'd just remove the mention of Pawniard completely...
2. Switch-in needs a dash. Pretty simple.
3. Moveslot is one word. I guess the for -> in change wasn't necessary, but it sounds better imo...
4. You don't need comprehensively and completely, and certainly not both at the same time. I think 'all' is sufficient in getting that point across. I changed a 2 into two because I think numbers (to a point) are written out... not sure about the 2-3 for Bone Rush, though.
5. Comma needs to be a semicolon here.

 

[Lumari]

practice

Substitute or Swords Dance can replace Fire Punch. The former will allow Cubone to take bypass (1) an incoming Will-O-Wisp, (RC) or Sucker Punch from Pawniard. (2) The latter gives Cubone even more power, ensuring its switch-ins (add hyphen, 3) don't survive the hit. If you're using either of these two options, it's recommended that you use Rock Slide for in (4) the third moveslot (one word) for better coverage, and that you don't use these with Trick Room Cubone, as they will waste one of your sweeping turns. Bone Rush can be used over Bonemerang if you wish to comprehensively (5) get past all Sturdy + Berry Juice users completely, (5) although 2-3 hits from Bone Rush are always going to be less powerful than 2 two (6) hits from Bonemerang, leaving this option outclassed. Earthquake can replace Bonemerang if you wish to have more accuracy, although you will then be forgoing (7) your the (8) ability to break through substitutes, (9) Focus Sashes, (10) and Sturdy. Double-Edge can be used in conjunction with the ability (11) Rock Head, replacing Fire Punch for with a solid 120 Base Power move; (RC, add semicolon) unfortunately, this option does not have grant (12) much coverage. Cubone can use Stealth Rock, but you're better off using Cubone's great power and coverage.

explanations

(1) poor wording, 'take' implies 'tank'; it doesn't take them, it avoids them
(2) unnecessary, unless Cubone has a specific niche as a Pawniard check, for which i'm missing context and which would be rather strange for OO anyway tbqh
(3) spelling convention
(4) contamination, either 'for' the third move or 'in' the third moveslot
(5) tautology anyway, and even one of them would be redundant, you either get past them or you don't lol
(6) spell out numbers under 20 (never seen a hypocrit before?)
(7) unnecessarily wordy
(8) 'your' is wrong regardless because the player doesn't have the ability, cubone does; 'Cubone's' would be fine too i suppose, but i preferred the article because any sort of emphasis provided by using the species name is rather unnecessary imo
(9) it's the noun, not the move. decapitalize it, and imo also use a plural because you're referring to instances
(10) kinda subjective but imo it refers more to (cases of) the item than to the concept
(11) redundant
(12) Cubone has coverage, the move doesn't really

 

[Ender]

Please direct all questions to Calm Pokemaster

Alright friends, here's the key

Key

Either Substitute or Swords Dance can replace Fire Punch.

Not necessary to add, but I felt that it made it sound better, especially given that this is the introductory sentence.

The former will allows Cubone to take a Sucker Punch from Pawniard or an incoming Will-O-Wisp [removed ,] or Sucker Punch from Pawniard , [. to ,] while the latter gives Cubone even more power, ensuring its switch-ins don't survive the hit.

Several changes here. First, changing "will allow" to "allows" keeps the verb form the same between "allow" and "give". I combined the two sentences since they were both addressing the same subject and neither is long or convoluted on its own (or together which is why the addition works). The sentences were joined by "while" and a comma. The way it was written previously makes it sound like Will-O-Wisp is going to be coming from Pawniard which obviously can't happen, so I moved that part to the beginning of the phrase for clarification. Switch-ins should be hyphenated because it is the noun form. This might have gotten lost among the changes, but there shouldn't be a comma before "or" when it's only two subjects. If there had been three, the comma would have been warranted.

If you're using either of these two options, it's also recommended that you use Rock Slide for in the third moveslot for better coverage [removed ,] and that you don't use these with Trick Room Cubone, as they will waste one of your its sweeping turns.

I added also to show that the recommendation is in addition to the previous options. This is potentially debatable, but "in" is really the better preposition to use rather than "for" when referring to moves on moveslots. Moveslot is not two words. The comma before "and" shouldn't exist because if you distill the sentence to its basic form, you have "it's recommend that you do this and that you do that" which doesn't require a comma before the "and". If it was "it's recommended that you do this, you do this, and that you do that", then yes, a comma would be required. Finally, the last "your" in the sentence refers to Cubone since it is the one sweeping, not the player, and writing should never equate the Pokemon to the player. The first and second "you're" and "you" are fine because they are explicitly referring to the player.

Bone Rush can be used over Bonemerang if you wish to comprehensively get past all Sturdy + Berry Juice users completely, although 2-3 hits from Bone Rush are always going to be less powerful than 2 two hits from Bonemerang, leaving this option outclassed.

Comprehensively and completely are both redundant with the inclusion of "all" so both can be deleted with the meaning still entirely conveyed. Numbers less than 10 should be spelt out, but 2-3 is fine because it's easier to convey numerically.

Earthquake can replace Bonemerang if you wish to have more accuracy, although you will then be forgoing your Cubone's ability to break through Substitute, Focus Sash, and Sturdy users.

The first you is fine because it refers to the player while the second instead refers to Cubone and thus should be changed.

Double-Edge can be used in conjunction with the ability Rock Head, replacing Fire Punch with for a solid 120 Base Power move; [, to ;] unfortunately, this option does not provide have much coverage.

It can be assumed that anyone reading this knows that Rock Head is an ability. This sentence becomes a run on so changing the comma to a semicolon splits it into two. With is a better preposition than for in this case. A semicolon is preferred to a period because the second phrase is subordinate to the first. Finally, provide is more specific than have and is thus the better option in this case.

Cubone has access to can use Stealth Rock, but it is more prudent to take advantage of its you're better off using Cubone's great power and coverage instead.

This sentence just needed some clarification to elucidate the point it is trying to make. Basically it's trying to say that Cubone's offensive capabilities are far more reason to use it than its support capabilities.

 

[Lumari]

Earthquake can replace Bonemerang if you wish to have more accuracy, although you will then be forgoing (7) your the (8) ability to break through substitutes, (9) Focus Sashes, (10) and Sturdy.

(9) it's the noun, not the move. decapitalize it, and imo also use a plural because you're referring to instances
(10) kinda subjective but imo it refers more to (cases of) the item than to the concept

Is this correct as well for the final part of this sentence? (if anything, I can still see 'Sturdy' being a problem this way; I thought it was fine, but now that I see an admittedly more elegant correction I'm not so sure anymore ^_^)

 

[Ender]

Is this correct as well for the final part of this sentence? (if anything, I can still see 'Sturdy' being a problem this way; I thought it was fine, but now that I see an admittedly more elegant correction I'm not so sure anymore ^_^)

No that's perfectly fine as well

 

[Calm Pokemaster]

Sorry for the long delay folks; I got a bit caught up with college work. Here's your next paragraph:

Hide

Mienshao is one of the few fastest threats with access to both of Fake Out and U-Turn, and the combination of these two moves can be really useful by allowing Mienshao to scout a multitude of offensive and defensive Pokemon. Fake Out allows Mienshao to inflict damage on most threats without taking any damage back for that turn and pick off weakened faster opponents, also showing in the process whether the damaged threat posesses Leftovers recovery or not. This improves prediction immensely, as you can now judge whether or not Mienshao should switch out hastily or stay in and fire off a nasty Hi Jump Kick. U-turn shifts the momentum in your favor, allowing you to scout what the opponent does on that turn and switch to a counter. This also deals extensive damage to Psychic types like Starmie and Latias switching in to soak up Hi Jump Kick. Hi Jump Kick is Mienshao's most powerful STAB move: it has an incredible 195 Base Power after STAB, and can 2HKO most neutral foes easily. However, Mienshao will lose 50% of its health if the opponent uses Protect or switches a Ghost-type, meaning prediction is a key when using Hi Jump Kick. This is compounded by the presence of Shadow Tag Chandelure in the metagame, which can OHKO, outspeed, and trap Mienshao if it is benefitting from the use of a Choice Scarf. Running Stone Edge in the last moveslot rectifies this issue, as this can allow Mienshao to KO Chandelure as it switches in while also destroying threats such as Volcarona. However, if Gliscor is a more problematic foe to your team, you can run Hidden Power Ice instead of Stone Edge to OHKO it with Stealth Rock damage; Mienshao can still escape from the wrath of Chandelure with its U-turn, allowing a teammate such as Tyranitar to trap it with Pursuit.

This time around, your focus will be on fixing the prose rather than correcting the grammar. Also keep in mind that though this is from an old analysis, you have to check it to our current standards ;)

 

[Lumari]

remove
add (Capitalize)
(comments)

my god this was ugly

Mienshao is one of the few fastest threats Pokemon (1) with access to both of (2) Fake Out and U-turn (3), and the combination of these two moves which (4) can be really useful by allowing allows (5) Mienshao it to act as an excellent scout a multitude of offensive and defensive Pokemon (6). Fake Out allows Mienshao to inflict chip damage on most threats without taking any damage back for that turn (7) and pick off weakened faster opponents, also showing in the process (8) whether the damaged threat posesses is holding Leftovers recovery or not (9). This improves eases (10) prediction immensely, as you can now judge whether or not Mienshao should switch out hastily or stay in and fire off a nasty Hi Jump Kick attack (11). (This sentence makes zero sense to me btw, I even might have chopped it but I can't ask the writer here what he means by it) U-turn shifts the momentum in your favor, (RC) and allowing allows you Mienshao to scout what the opponent does on that turn and switch to a counter (12). This It also deals extensive solid (13) damage to Psychic-types (add dash) like Starmie and Latias switching in to soak up take (14) High Jump Kick (15), such as Starmie and Latias (16). High (15) Jump Kick is Mienshao's most powerful STAB move: it has an incredible 195 Base Power after STAB, (17) and can easily (18) 2HKO most neutral foes that take neutral damage (19) easily. However, Mienshao will lose 50% of its health if the opponent uses Protect or switches a Ghost-type, because of its detrimental side effect, (20) meaning prediction is a key especially important (21) when using High Jump Kick (15). This is compounded by the presence of Shadow Tag Chandelure in the metagame (22), which can trap Mienshao and proceed to outspeed and OHKO it, outspeed, and trap Mienshao (23) if it is benefitting from the use of holding (24) a Choice Scarf. Running Stone Edge in the last moveslot rectifies remedies (25) this issue, as this can allows (26) Mienshao to KO Chandelure as it switches in, (AC, 27) while also destroying threats such as Volcarona. However, if Gliscor is a more problematic foe to your team, you can run Hidden Power Ice instead of Stone Edge to OHKO it with after (28) Stealth Rock damage; if you opt for this, (29) Mienshao can still escape from the wrath of Chandelure with its U-turn (30), allowing a teammate such as Tyranitar to trap it with Pursuit.

explanations

(1) 'few fastest' is terrible, i took it to mean 'fastest, which are few' or 'very fastest', leaving 'few' redundant. also 'threats' is a rather poor word choice in this context because it means 'pokemon you should prepare for', which is inappropriate here
(2) small grammar thing, the general expression is 'both...and'. 'of' is not wrong per se i guess, but it is unnecessarily verbose and looks worse than the standard expression
(3) spelling
(4) unnecessarily verbose and it looks better to put this into a subordinate clause because unnecessary parataxis is yucky
(5) the epitome of fluff
(6) unnecessarily verbose but not wrong or hideous per se. what pushed me over the edge was that the original seems to imply there are some definite pokemon mienshao is supposed to scout, which isn't the case.
(7) again, epitome of fluff, 'chip damage' means exactly the same. well, technically i should be writing 'free chip damage' because weak attacks that do allow the opponent to hit back provide chip damage as well, but everybody knows that fake out is free damage and it would be rather ugly.
(8) fluff
(9) unbelievably awkward wording
(10) bad wording, 'improving' prediction would be 'making more accurate predictions', which using fake out itself doesn't do. what is does do is making future predictions easier :]
(11) two cases of fluff
(12) the entire 'what the opponent does on that turn' is redundant with 'scout', and 'switch to a counter' is redundant with the momentum part
(13) awkward wording
(14) same
(15) 'gp this to our current standards' is a euphemism for 'use updated move spellings'. voilà.
(16) moved this to the back because having it in the middle of the sentence unnecessarily disturbed the flow, the examples are more of an afterthought. also such as > like of course
(17) fluff
(18) fixing up the awkwardness causes by my own corrections :] it wasn't wrong having it in the back, but after writing out the 'neutral' part it was way too far back to read comfortably
(19) 'neutral foes' can't be used in this sense
(20) stupidly verbose, everybody knows this
(21) prediction's always a key, but moreso here, adjusted wording accordingly
(22) fluff
(23) order is way off. it always traps it, and if the choice scarf part is mentioned afterwards, the specifics pertaining to this situation should be mentioned after the trapping itself. also adjusted the wording in order to make it a) trap and b) outspeed and OHKO (because both of these are the specifics pertaining to the scarf situation) rather than a) trap, b) outspeed, and c) OHKO.
(24) epitome of fluff/verbosity
(25) awkward wording
(26) 'can allow' is redundant, if stone edge is run it does allow mienshao to OHKO lamp
(27) this is an afterthought if i've ever seen one, because the entirety of the context deals with chandelure. therefore, a more explicit separation from the remainder of the sentence is warranted
(28) wrong preposition, SR doesn't OHKO stuff
(29) i reckon this was implied, but i made it explicit in order to improve the flow
(30) two cases of ugly fluff

 

[Calm Pokemaster]

Was this too tough folks? In any case, I give you another day to give this a try before I post the answer.

 

[P Squared]

school started up again and i forgot to post this reply D:

Hide

Mienshao is one of the few fastest threats with access to both of Fake Out and U-turn, and the combination of these two moves can be really useful by allowsing Mienshao to scout a multitude of offensive and defensive Pokemon (1). Fake Out allows Mienshao to pick off weakened faster opponents, as well as inflict free damage on most threats and reveal whether they have Leftovers without taking any damage back for that turn and pick off weakened faster opponents, also showing in the process whether the damaged threat posesses Leftovers recovery or not (2). This improveases prediction immensely, as you can now judge whether or not Mienshao should switch out hastily or stay in and fire off a nasty High Jump Kick. U-turn shifts the momentum in your favor, allowing you to scout what the opponent does on that turn the opponent's move and switch to a counter. This also deals extensive damage to Psychic-types (3) like Starmie and Latias switching in to soak up High Jump Kick like Starmie and Latias (4). High Jump Kick is Mienshao's most powerful STAB move: it has an incredible 195 Base Power after STAB, and can 2HKO most neutral foes easily. However, Mienshao will lose 50% of its health if the opponent uses Protect or switches into a Ghost-type, meaning prediction is a key when using High Jump Kick. This is compounded by the presence of Shadow Tag Chandelure is particularly dangerous, as it in the metagame, which can OHKO, trap, outspeed, and OHKO (5) trap Mienshao if it is benefitting from the use of holding a Choice Scarf. Running Stone Edge in the last moveslot rectifies this issue, as this can allow allowing Mienshao to KO Chandelure on the switch as it switches in while also destroying threats such as Volcarona. However, Mienshao can still escape from Chandelure with just U-turn, so if Gliscor is a more problematic foe to for your team, you can run Hidden Power Ice instead of Stone Edge to OHKO it with Stealth Rock damage; Mienshao can still escape from the wrath of Chandelure with its U-turn, allowing a teammate such as Tyranitar to trap it with Pursuit (6).

explanations

1. 'Few fastest' had to go. I decided to cut few instead of fastest, because Mienshao's speed seemed more important than its, um, rare ability to use both moves. U-Turn --> U-turn. The rest of the edits were just cutting down on fluff.
2. I switched the order around here because the Leftovers part seemed to be what the following sentence ('this eases prediction') was referring to. Other fluff-cutting, too.
3. Needs a dash.
4. Wasn't sure about this, as Starmie probably doesn't want to take any High Jump Kicks. If it's just Latias that is soaking up High Jump Kicks, then I would leave it as 'Psychic-types like Latias switching in to soak up High Jump Kick and Starmie', I guess.
5. It doesn't make much sense to me to have it in the order OHKO, trap, outspeed. Switched it around.
6. Trying to get this to flow well and in a sensible order was tough, but I think it's an improvement...

 

[fleurdyleurse]

C_P has a test so posting for him

check

Mienshao is one of the few fastest (1) threats with access to both of (2) Fake Out and U-Tturn (3), and the combination of these two moves can be really useful by allowing Mienshao to scout a multitude of offensive and defensive Pokemon is a potent scouting tool (4). Fake Out allows Mienshao to inflict damage on most threats without taking any damage back for that turn (5) and pick off weakened faster opponents, also showing while revealing (6) in the process whether the damaged threat posesses the presence (or absence) of (7) Leftovers recovery or not (8). This improves eases (9) prediction immensely, as you can now judge whether or not Mienshao should switch out hastily (10) or stay in and fire off a nasty powerful High Jump Kick (11) (12). U-turn shifts the momentum in your favor, allowing you to scout what the opponent's move does on that turn (13) and switch to a counter. This It (14) also deals extensive damage to Psychic-types like such as (15) Starmie and Latias switching in to soak up High Jump Kick (16). High Jump Kick (17) is Mienshao's most powerful STAB move: it has an incredible 195 Base Power after STAB, and can 2HKO most neutral foes easily. However, Mienshao will lose 50% of its health if the opponent uses Protect or switches a Ghost-type in (18), meaning prediction is a (19) key when using High Jump Kick (20). This is compounded by the presence of Shadow Tag Chandelure in the metagame, which can OHKO trap, outspeed, and trap Mienshao (21) if it is benefitting from the use using of a Choice Scarf (22). Running Stone Edge in the last moveslot rectifies this issue, as this can it allows (23) Mienshao to KO Chandelure as it switches in while also destroying threats such as Volcarona. However, if Gliscor is a more problematic foe to your team, you can run Hidden Power Ice instead of Stone Edge to OHKO it with after (24) Stealth Rock damage; Mienshao can still escape from the wrath of (25) Chandelure with its (26) U-turn, allowing a teammate such as Tyranitar to trap it with Pursuit.

explanations

1) in this sentence, what you want to highlight is that

• mien is fast
• mien has access to fake out + u-turn

as such, the "est" is removed to highlight those two points
2) grammatically incorrect here; if you want to use "both of", you must use "both of the moves", which is ambiguous
3) U-turn, not U-Turn
4) fluff
5) fluff
6) "while" because "and" would be slightly repetitive; if you want to use "and", it would have to be "reveals" instead of "revealing". "reveal" because you are not showing something, you are revealing something
7) fluff
8) fluff and doesn't work with changes
9) "eases" because you aren't improving your prediction, you are making it easier to predict the opponent's move
10) fluff
11) nasty isn't very good wording here
12) Gen 6 standards: High Jump Kick, not Hi Jump Kick (last gen)
13) less fluff; better wording. it should be noted that "opponent" refers to the person you are playing against; use "foe" or "enemy" to indicate "the opposing Pokemon"
14) more clarity
15) as mentioned earlier in this thread, such as is used for listing examples, while like is used to mean "in the same vein". as such, such as is correct here.
16) see 12
17) see 12
18) switch something in, not switch something. it can also be switches in a Ghost-type.
19) word collocation: no prediction is a key
20) see 12
21) the order has to make sense; it can't OHKO then outspeed
22) fluff
23) better wording, and removed passive
24) you don't OHKO something with Stealth Rock damage, but you can OHKO something after Stealth Rock damage
25) this suggests that you're not actually escaping from chandelure, just its wrath; it's also fluff
26) fluff

please direct all questions to me, all errors are mine

 

[Calm Pokemaster]

Sorry guys, this has been coming for a while, but I simply haven't had enough time to actively monitor this thread. I might re-open this at some later date (maybe after ORAS, I dunno), but this is going to be closed for now.