Project Know Your Niche

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idea and OP by Berks shamelessly copy-pasted



Have you ever tried to build around a certain Pokemon, but found that it left too many holes in your team for standard sets to cover? Have you ever found yourself looking for a 6th Pokemon to add to a team, knowing exactly what you have left to cover, but just couldn't find a mon that fit? These teambuilding traumas trouble me every time I try to build a team, and I'm sure I'm not alone.

Well, then, my fellow Little Cuppers, what is there to be done?

Welcome to Know Your Niche, the new LC Community project in which we sleuth out all those niches you never knew you'd need! Each week or so, there will be a new niche on the slate; it could range anywhere from "submit your best partner for x mon" to "submit a Stealth Rock user that can hold its own against y mon". You'll have some time to submit sets you've found that fulfill the given niche, along with an exploration of exactly how and how well your set fills said niche. Submissions will close, the community will vote, and the winning set will be featured in the Niche Archive for the future reference of all LC team builders! Also be sure to only post 1 Pokemon a week, and include a set along with an explanation.

You can find the current week's assignment in the post below!


Niche Archive:
  • Pokemon must be able to at least not be 2HKOed by Sludge Bomb, Weather Ball, and Solar Beam from Bellsprout after Stealth Rock, and not be KOed by Acid Downpour into any of the previous moves
  • Pokemon should have a status inflicting move, a set up move, hazards, hazard removal, or a status inflicting move
Winner: Chespin @ Eviolite
Ability: Bulletproof
Level: 5
EVs: 68 HP / 28 Atk / 156 Def / 236 SpD
Impish Nature
- Seed Bomb / Zen Headbutt
- Protect
- Spikes
- Synthesis

I believe that Chespin is the ultimate sun check.
With Bulletproof, it is completely immune to both Sludge Bomb and Weather Ball, and thanks to its typing, it resists Solar Beam and is unaffected by Sleep Powder (unlike most alternatives!). What about Acid Downpour? No problem. When you use Protect, the damage is reduced by 75%, so at most it's going to deal as little as 9 damage. With Synthesis, Bellsprout has absolutely no way to touch Chespin, allowing a free opportunity to set up Spikes. It's also worth noting that Chespin is a generally reliable and bulky Spikes user that can wall other common threats like Mudbray, Foongus, and Gastly.

You could run Zen Headbutt over Seed Bomb if you want Chespin to be able to super effectively hit Bellsprout, Foongus, and Gastly, but they can't really do anything versus it anyway, and having no STAB move can be a large hindrance.
I guess you could run a Bulk Up set instead of Spikes too if you run less Defense EVs and more HP EVs.

  • Pokemon must carry a Z-crystal and a corresponding move
  • Pokemon must have good synergy with any Mudbray set; all participants must list at least one example, i.e. a Mudbray check it can counter, a way it can heal up Mudbray, etc.
Winner: Ponyta @ Grassium Z
Ability: Flame Body
Level: 5
EVs: 36 HP / 236 SpA / 196 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Solar Beam
- Sunny Day / Flame Charge / Hypnosis / Will-O-Wisp
- Morning Sun
- Fire Blast

Hardcounters Pumpkaboo, Snivy (Glare is annoying, but that shit annoys everything), Chespin (Rock Slide can be a problem but Pony bulky and Chespin aint). It can also switch in on annoying ice moves from ice types. It's speedtier is also amazing, outspeeding 90% of the meta.

"But Fille, a Fire type can't switch in on a water type!!" True. What Ponyta does though, is BAIT water types. Of course, Z Sunny day allows it to outspeed everything, but ppl see sunny Day and immidiately switch out their water type again. Boom, trap gone. Grassium Z Solar Beam tho ... That shit hits hard af, and hits any incoming water type.

Water/Poison types (Skrelp/Mareanie/Tentacool) still 1v1 this Ponyta, however, neither of those are able to tank an EQ from basically any Mudbray, and Tentacool is the only one that can possibly outspeed (Unless scarf Mudbray). Dewpider(Mudbray get's Rock Slide smfh Fille) is a hardcounter to this sweet little Mudbray/Ponyta core, and Abra can be a bitch (Chance to OHKO Pony with Psychic and speedties while at most being brought down to sash, hits Mudbray hard with Energy Ball.) Corphish / Shellder are also not baited out by Ponyta, fearing the Will-O-Wisp. Both are able to set up on Mudbray.

Sunny Day is probably the most reasonable option, weakening water type moves, boosting Morning Sun/Fire Blast and giving Solar Beam no charge time, but Flame Charge can be used for speed/Diglett/Abra?, while Hypnosis is a risky but fun option for ... Abra? WoW is just great yk and makesit easier to abuse Stamina for Mudbray.
236 SpA Ponyta Bloom Doom (190 BP) vs. 76 HP / 148 SpD Eviolite Chinchou: 22-26 (88 - 104%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO
(22, 22, 22, 22, 22, 22, 22, 22, 24, 24, 24, 24, 24, 24, 24, 26)
Guaranteed OHKO after Fire Blast damage.
236 SpA Ponyta Bloom Doom (190 BP) vs. 116 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Staryu: 24-30 (114.2 - 142.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
(24, 24, 26, 26, 26, 26, 26, 26, 26, 28, 28, 28, 28, 28, 28, 30)

236 SpA Ponyta Bloom Doom (190 BP) vs. 196 HP / 116 SpD Eviolite Slowpoke: 24-30 (85.7 - 107.1%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO
(24, 24, 26, 26, 26, 26, 26, 26, 26, 28, 28, 28, 28, 28, 28, 30)
OHKO after Fire Blast damage.
Everything else is basically OHKOd.

Synergy-wise, these 2 Ponies obviously both share that sweet Water Weakness. That problem is, however, solved with the offensive presence of both. Pony switches in on Grass/Ice type moves (And pokemons) that Mudbray struggles with, while Mudbray hardcounters most of the Rock types in the tier that Pony struggles with, and a bulkier set can switch in on the remaining Ground types that Pony does not like. Z-Solar Beam obviously deals with random slower Ground/Rock types, but manny of these carries Sturdy, which makes it a bit harder again for Pony to deal with them. Mudbray does not give a fuck.
 
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Our first niche is as follows:

Sunscreen:
Objective: Find a reliable sun check with utility beyond only that.

Requirements:
  • Pokemon must be able to at least not be 2HKOed by Sludge Bomb, Weather Ball, and Solar Beam from this Bellsprout after Stealth Rock, and not be KOed by Acid Downpour into any of the previous moves
  • Pokemon should have a status inflicting move, a set up move, hazards, hazard removal, or a status inflicting move

Good Luck! Starting off fairly easy so everyone can get the hang of this!
 
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hold off on posts till i edit this post saying you can please!

Edit: OK post away, I fixed up the thread and the niche with some help from a few friends.
 
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Gummy

...three, smiles go for miles!
So this set is pretty bad, but there aren't any rules against memes! :D

Jangmo-o @ Eviolite
Level: 5
Ability: Bulletproof
EVs: 236 Atk / 236 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Outrage
- Toxic
- Earthquake
- Brick Break

After Stealth Rock, Outrage has a fairly high chance to OHKO Bellsprout. Toxic is a pretty garbage move on Jangmo-o but if you really want it (and its in the rules lol), there it is. Sludge Bomb doesn't touch Jangmo-o and Solar Beam only nets a 3HKO. Acid Downpour 2HKOes, but you can fiddle with the EVs and nature to make this bulky if you, again, really want to.
 

Nineage

Pugnacious.
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Lickitung @ Eviolite
Level: 5
Ability: Oblivious
EVs: 196 HP / 76 Def / 236 SpD
Impish Nature
- Wish
- Protect
- Body Slam
- Knock Off

Lickitung may not be interesting, but it takes 0 from Bellsprout's attacks, can stall out sun with Wish, and support its teammates with the combination of Wish and Knock Off, two valuable support moves in this meta. I was originally going to suggest Cloud 9 on Lickitung, but honestly you still take basically nothing from Weather Ball, and it seems better to me to be able to beat taunt users and stuff more reliably.
 
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Just gonna give 2 standards and 1 cool one


Munchlax
Not surprising really, this is why this thing is so amazing, it just counter sun. Juice lives anything bar Acid Downpour and Evio lives acid downpour+weather ball. Not many good sun answers but this is one of the better ones


Hippopotas
Counters Bellsprout rn. Bellsprout are not running grass STAB other than solarbeam on sun and then sprout can only hit you with sludge bomb which does 24% max to standard hippo.


Tentacool
This thing is taking ALOT from sprout, but unless sleep powder it beats any bellsprout set 1v1. If tentacool is evio, Bellsprout never 2hkoes after rocks. If juice it does 70% max, juice activates, you sludge bomb or ice beam. Sludge bomb has a 68% chance to 2hko after rocks, or you could run theif, steal his evio after juice is activated and revenge bellsprout with something else. Overall not the best stop, but a very soft check nonetheless
Ok I know I forgot to say them in the OP but I'll say them now:
1. Please only pick one Pokemon per week
2. Please include a set
3. Please provide a bit more explanation that 1 or 2 sentences
4. PLEASE make sure the Pokemon fit the criteria

I suggest you repost choosing only one of those Pokemon with in these in mind!
 

Fiend

someguy
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LC Leader
I've had this lil monster sitting in my teambuilder for awhile.


Litwick @ Berry Juice
Ability: Flash Fire
Level: 5
EVs: 116 HP / 76 Def / 236 SpA / 76 SpD
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Fire Blast
- Trick Room
- Shadow Ball
- Substitute / Will-O-Wisp​

So while Trick Room itself isn't the best, it sure has some fun mons to use and can really dick offense teams. Very little likes Litwick's STAB combo, and seeing as with a TR set you almost half to use The Dew alongside it even fat Water-types don't actually get many chances to eat up Shadow Ball. Fire Blast OHKOs Bellsprout even without Sun up, while Trick Room is the utility move. The last move is really just meant to cause issues with Pawniard, with Wisp being kinda useful for injuring Munchlax.

Even with SR up, Bellsprout 3HKOs at best. Acid Downpour doesn't do enough to OHKO you despite what calc says. It appears to be broken.

196+ SpA Bellsprout Sludge Bomb (175 BP) vs. 116 HP / 76 SpD Litwick: 12-15 (52.1 - 65.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
(12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 13, 13, 13, 13, 13, 14, 14, 14, 14, 14, 15)
 
Ok I know I forgot to say them in the OP but I'll say them now:
1. Please only pick one Pokemon per week
2. Please include a set
3. Please provide a bit more explanation that 1 or 2 sentences
4. PLEASE make sure the Pokemon fit the criteria

I suggest you repost choosing only one of those Pokemon with in these in mind!
MB :]
Edited
 

Chespin @ Eviolite
Ability: Bulletproof
Level: 5
EVs: 68 HP / 28 Atk / 156 Def / 236 SpD
Impish Nature
- Seed Bomb / Zen Headbutt
- Protect
- Spikes
- Synthesis

I believe that Chespin is the ultimate sun check.
With Bulletproof, it is completely immune to both Sludge Bomb and Weather Ball, and thanks to its typing, it resists Solar Beam and is unaffected by Sleep Powder (unlike most alternatives!). What about Acid Downpour? No problem. When you use Protect, the damage is reduced by 75%, so at most it's going to deal as little as 9 damage. With Synthesis, Bellsprout has absolutely no way to touch Chespin, allowing a free opportunity to set up Spikes. It's also worth noting that Chespin is a generally reliable and bulky Spikes user that can wall other common threats like Mudbray, Foongus, and Gastly.

You could run Zen Headbutt over Seed Bomb if you want Chespin to be able to super effectively hit Bellsprout, Foongus, and Gastly, but they can't really do anything versus it anyway, and having no STAB move can be a large hindrance.
I guess you could run a Bulk Up set instead of Spikes too if you run less Defense EVs and more HP EVs.
 
From the gutters of the low ladder...

Salandit @ Eviolite
Ability: Oblivious
Level: 5
EVs: 116 Def / 192 SpA / 200 SpD
Modest Nature
IVs: 1 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 SpD
- Flamethrower
- Hidden Power [Ground]
- Sludge Wave
- Torment / Will-O-Wisp / Taunt

After some experimenting, I noticed that Salandit is actually a great sunscreen option. This set is unorthodox and is strictly for anti-sun teams. It doesn't have any conventional use, but it works incredibly as an anti-sun niche. With the EV investment and the Eviolite, Salandit tanks all of Bellsprout's attacks and requires at least a 3HKO after Stealth Rocks(peep the calcs). Flamethrower is a definite 1HKO against Bellsprout, which fulfills Salandit's role. Outside of Bellsprout, HP Ground is there for Vulpix, as Salandit can deal with that as well. The last spot is totally open, but I've found Torment to be pretty good. The standard Salandit set draws out scarfed opponents, and a Torment on the switch can mess them up. If Torment doesn't count as a status inflicting move, Will-O-Wisp or Taunt are useful options as well. This set completely shuts down Bellsprout and can also deal with Bulbasaur and Vulpix. Meet your new anti-sun god :')

196+ SpA Bellsprout Weather Ball (100 BP Fire) vs. 0 HP / 200 SpD Eviolite Salandit in Sun: 5-6 (23.8 - 28.5%) -- 87.5% chance to 3HKO after Stealth Rock
196+ SpA Bellsprout Sludge Bomb vs. 0 HP / 200 SpD Eviolite Salandit: 4-6 (19 - 28.5%) -- 11.7% chance to 3HKO after Stealth Rock
196+ SpA Bellsprout Solar Beam vs. 0 HP / 200 SpD Eviolite Salandit: 3-3 (14.2 - 14.2%) -- guaranteed 6HKO after Stealth Rock
196+ SpA Bellsprout Sludge Bomb (175 BP) vs. 0 HP / 200 SpD Eviolite Salandit: 8-10 (38 - 47.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
 
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Coconut

W
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LC Leader
fine...


Flatline - B.O.B. (Mantyke) @ Berry Juice
Ability: Swift Swim
Level: 5
EVs: 156 HP / 196 SpA / 196 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Rain Dance
- Air Slash
- Sleep Talk
- Defog Haze

eats solar beam and pops bj
laughs at the other moves
sets rain and outspeeds
kills easily with air slash
last two moves can be literally anything, wasn't feeling creative :(
defog just so it fits the criteria

edit: also all these sets except for mine lose because this bellsprout can run either growth or sleep powder and none of the sets beat both.

edit: good catch, let's make that haze
 
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Xayah

San Bwanna
is a Community Contributoris a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus
fine...


Flatline - B.O.B. (Mantyke) @ Berry Juice
Ability: Swift Swim
Level: 5
EVs: 156 HP / 196 SpA / 196 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Rain Dance
- Air Slash
- Sleep Talk
- Defog

eats solar beam and pops bj
laughs at the other moves
sets rain and outspeeds
kills easily with air slash
last two moves can be literally anything, wasn't feeling creative :(
defog just so it fits the criteria

edit: also all these sets except for mine because this bellsprout can run either growth or sleep powder and none of the sets beat both.
Mantyke doesn't get Defog

EDIT: Just so this isn't just a one liner:

Lickitung.gif

Lickitung @ Eviolite
Ability: Oblivious
Level: 5
EVs: 196 HP / 76 Def / 236 SpD
Impish Nature
- Wish
- Protect
- Body Slam
- Heal Bell / Knock Off

Now I know this doesn't fit the criteria, but a Wish passing cleric doesn't lack utility by any means. In general, Lickitung is outclassed by Spritzee in this role, but as a sun check, it outshines it. It doesn't take much at all from any of Bellsprout's moves and can 2HKO back with Body Slam. It doesn't really like Sleep Powder, and can't really switch in on Bellsprout out of fear of Growth, but it can easily come in on Vulpix and start Body Slamming or Wishing to prevent a sweep.


EDIT 2: Screw Nineage
 
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Can we vote for ourselves..? Lol.
im insecure about my building capabilities and need to secure at least one vote so i feel good about myself

Edit:
#1: YelloMello and that sexy lookin Salandit
#2: MeButYou82's Chespin
Meme: Plasmagby's Tentacool bc Plasmagby
 
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Rowan

The professor?
is a Community Leader Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus
Mantyke
Chespin

I hate these sets are too specialised either to fit criteria or to just wall sprout. Tyke would want water stab over haze, and I'd rsther run 2 attacks over protect on chespin, and just switch out to a steel and switch back to avoid the acid downpour. However they're the best 2 answers to bellsproit here, the rest get dogged by sleep powder
E: I think rain dance should coiunt as a set up move since you are SS so I think it would still fit criteria with scald or hydro > haze
Best meme is jangmoo cos its adorable
 
Winners:
1. MeButYou82 's Chespin
2. Coconut 's Mantyke
Best Meme: Plasmagby 's Tentacool

Your second assignment:

Perfect PairingZ 1:
Objective: Find a Z-move user who can pair well with Mudbray.

Requirements:
  • Pokemon must carry a Z-crystal and a corresponding move
  • Pokemon must have good synergy with any Mudbray set; all participants must list at least one example, i.e. a Mudbray check it can counter, a way it can heal up Mudbray, etc.

Good Luck!
 

Xayah

San Bwanna
is a Community Contributoris a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus
Chinchou @ Waterium Z
Ability: Volt Absorb
Level: 5
EVs: 52 Def / 228 SpA / 220 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Rain Dance
- Thunder
- Hydro Pump
- Ice Beam

This Chinchou set is capable of easily cleaning late game if opposing Electric-types are gone. Guess what type Mudbray is immune to AND threatens very heavily. In addition, it also significantly threatens Water-, Flying-, and (to some extent) Grass-types that Mudbray does not appreciate.

PS: I'm starting to think that this is just what H0W3AN uses to build his teams
 

Rowan

The professor?
is a Community Leader Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus
Ponyta @ Firium Z
Ability: Flame Body
Level: 5
EVs: 156 Def / 156 SpA / 196 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sunny Day
- Fire Blast
- Solar Beam
- Morning Sun


it switches in on grass types that threaten mudbray. it uses sunnybeam to lure/remove mudbray's water type counters and weaken their water stab.
 

Gummy

...three, smiles go for miles!
well since only two people have posted and they're both decent sets, we need SOMEONE to win best meme

Snivy @ Grassium Z
Level: 5
Ability: Contrary
EVs: 240 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Leaf Storm
- Worry Seed
- Glare
- Hidden Power Ice

z-worry seed gives you +1 Spe which patches up Snivy's average Speed, letting it KO Staryu without fearing an Ice Beam. HP Ice hits other Grass-types. Glare can paralyze stuff that Mudbray is outsped by, allowing it to get the upper hand. Once Mudbray's checks have been eliminated it can come in safely enough.

edit: forgot about contrary. whatever just run overgrow.
 
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