SM Ubers Once Upon A Something...

Minority

Numquam Vincar
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Once Upon A… umm… Something. Well, it happened a long time ago. On a great continent north of the rest of the world lay an ancient kingdom. For many years the kingdom was a peaceful sanctuary where some of the mightiest warriors came to train. But soon, tragedy befell this land. A dragon – a massive green serpent, lay waste to the once peaceful kingdom. There were rumors among travelers that the seemingly peaceful kingdom was in fact wicked – one whose rulers defiled the voice of their people and that the dragon was heavens’ divine will sent to put an end to the kingdom’s evildoers. As to if the kingdom was actually wicked or the dragon was sent from the heavens, nobody knows for sure.

Upon the arrival of the beast, the greatest warriors took up arms. They used every tool they had crafted in their kingdom’s great history – swords, arrows, catapults, some say soup ladles. They fought against the dragon hour after hour, day after day. And yet, even among the great warriors protected by their armor of old, no weapon proved effective. The kingdom was divided in resolution. Many continued to fight. Some prayed to the heavens. Others tried to continue with life as normal. There is a rumor that one fled to a faraway land, never to return.

But there is one with the power to slay the foul beast.

Through the history of the ancient kingdom are many legends of fabled warriors – the Myth of Flaming Cloak, the Legend of the Magic Chamber, and one that has something to do with a ringing metallic sound. But even among these warriors of legend is one who stands above all others. Ancient texts call him the warrior of ten thousand. What this number represents is unknown – perhaps his number of victories, the number of stones he could carry, or even the number of days he once went without food. He does not use a sword, a shield, or arrows of any kind. Among his weapons is a hammer, rumored to be even greater than that of Ajax or Thor, but in truth, no one has actually seen it.

After seven days and seven nights of constant battle, the kingdom failed to conquer the dragon. The castle, villages, and fields burned. But on the eighth day, everything changed.

From the heavens descended the metal-faced warrior of ten thousand. With a single swing of his mighty hammer, the dragon was smashed high into the sky, sent to descend upon some other forsaken continent. The ancient kingdom was finally freed of the seemingly unstoppable dragon, and just as quick as the warrior of ten thousand appeared, he disappeared, never to be seen by the kingdom again. Much of the kingdom rejoiced. Others felt they could have slayed the beast themselves. Talk that seven days were not enough to prepare the kingdom’s defense grew among the people. Even today, some in the kingdom yearn for the dragon’s return.

In the dragon’s wake new beasts arose from the mountains, canyons, and seas, but none of them quite like the mighty dragon. And with these new beats the kingdom still thrives, greater than its even been, as old legends and rumors proliferate from the kingdom’s rich history. Today the warriors continue to fight the lesser beasts, filled with hope and the expansion of their kingdom, but some say darkness has gathered once again.


Once Upon A Something
is the story where those great beasts of the modern age are fought, in the very same kingdom of legend.


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The structure of this team is based on one of my favorite post-Marshadow builds from Sun and Moon, updated with a few Pokemon and techniques that are standouts in Ultra Sun and Moon. The focus of the team is primarily on offensive synergy. Double Dance Necrozma-DM, Special Rock Polish Primal Groudon, and Mixed Primal Kyogre form the offensive core, supported by the utility Mega Salamence, Arceus-Fairy, and Marshadow have to offer. The combination of these three offensive threats is harsh on defensive builds, which rely on bulkmons and support Arceus to form their counter play against such threats.




With good structure, defense against esoteric threats naturally follows. New players often overlook the power of cohesive synergy and the simple utilization of effective Pokemon. Such choices often create a natural defense against many of the oddities that can appear, and tend to craft builds that are far less reliant on opponent perception and consequently more consistent. Unorthodox sets and nichemons have their place, but among newer players there seems to be an obsession with trying to use weird Pokemon and sets just for the sake of it. The reality is that good Pokemon rise above sad attempts at innovation and stand tall.

This is what Once Upon A Somewhere strives to be – an option filled, no nonsense, straightforward approach to offensive USM teambuilding via strong Pokemon.


Once Upon A Something began as a Marshadow team in SM. The original core was Marshadow, Arceus-Fairy, and Mega Salamence, which focused on options for waging hazard war and taking momentum from opposing offenses, yet leaving room for powerful offensive threats. Ferrothorn was used to check Primal Kyogre, fill some basic Steel-type synergy needs, and have a way to punish certain defensive Pokemon. Primal Groudon and Primal Kyogre meet the remaining defensive synergy needs while functioning as offensive powerhouses. This was one of my favorite builds from post-Marshadow SM so I revisited and adapted it to USM.


In the transition from post-Marshadow SM to USM, Necrozma obtained a powerful new form and both Stealth Rock and Defog were made more accessible. Ferrothorn was replaced with Necrozma-DM and Marshadow was temporarily swapped out for Scarf Yveltal. The change to Necrozma-DM was motivated by a desire for a more proactive built, which naturally lent itself toward once again closing the gap against Primal Kyogre. The inclusion of Necrozma-DM allowed for more severe punish opportunities via Swords Dance or Rock Polish. This is especially potent against a plethora of defensive Pokemon as they simply have no good options to punish Necrozma-DM, or are forced to run moves such as Will-O-Wisp. Scarf Yveltal is used on this variant in order to cover niche offensive Pokemon such as Lunala, Arceus-Ghost, and Deoxys-A supported by Psychic Terrain.


This variant is what is discussed in the RMT proper. Marshadow was reinstated despite the loss of a reactive check to Choice Specs Lunala and Arceus-Ghost. While these two Pokmeon perform very similar roles, the points of contention were that Marshadow is able to Pursuit, better mess with slow boosters, has true priority, and drops a Stealth Rock weakness. Note that sets adjusted for Speed creep are not included in the builder's analysis.




There are other variations, mainly focusing on Xerneas instead of Arceus-Fairy, addition of a new offensive Arceus, and the reallocation of Stealth Rock. This requires a change of two or more Pokemon, and is manifest as the use of Geomancy or Scarf Xerneas alongside a Swords Dance or Calm Mind Arceus. This family of builds has a much less resilient Fairy-type and typically have to relegate Stealth Rock to Primal Groudon, but have other advantages.





Necrozma-DM

Ability: Prism Armor
EVs: 124 HP / 252 Atk / 132 Spe
Adamant Nature
-
Rock Polish
-
Swords Dance
-
Earthquake
-
Sunsteel Strike

Double Dance Necrozma-DM is a frightening offensive threat with the ability to punish a variety of defensive Pokemon. Even against offenses, this Pokemon can find a plethora of setup opportunities thanks to its high natural bulk. Rock Polish provides just enough Speed to outpace what is typical from hyper or bulky offense teams while Swords Dance and Solganium Z are enough to bust through many defensive Pokemon. This is the team’s primary check to Xerneas, and also functions as a way to rob momentum from opposing Arceus-Fairy, Magearna, Mega Diancie, Mega Salamence, blobs, and certain defensive Steels.



Mega Salamence

Ability: Aerialate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
-
Dragon Dance
-
Defog
-
Roost
-
Double-Edge

A fast Defog Mega Salamence provides a potential out vs. suicide hazard setters, especially Sticky Web, along with an option for intermediate or emergency hazard control. Dragon Dance is used in order to help limit how much momentum the set yields and so that it may still function as a win condition. Double-Edge is preferred as it OHKOs Mega Lucario unboosted and is overall harsher on neutral bulky Pokemon. Earthquake may be used in order to have better options vs. Steels, mainly opposing Necrozma-DM, as Dragon Dance alone is not enough to prevent the yield of momentum vs. these. The main focus of this set is utility – fighting hazard war, Intimidate, and providing some additional options vs. threats such as Primal Groudon, Swords Dance Arceus, and Mega Lucario.



Arceus-Fairy

Ability: Multitype
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
-
Stealth Rock
-
Toxic
-
Recover
-
Judgment

Arceus-Fairy has many strengths as a Stealth Rock setter, focusing on staying power, reliability, and effectiveness vs. Magic Bouncers in addition to prowess against Yveltal and Marshadow. While comparatively ironclad in these roles, this is undoubtedly the most passive Pokemon on the team, and one of the first places a good opponent looks when trying to regain momentum. Trappers such as Mega Gengar and Gothitelle are especially eager to this, and are why Marshadow runs Pursuit. Stone Edge is an option I’ve used in order to relinquish less momentum vs. Ho-Oh - especially vs. double Defog teams that employ Ho-Oh as anti-hazard. In short, Arceus-Fairy is here to get Stealth Rock and ensure Dark-types can’t pick on Necrozma-DM.



Primal Groudon

Ability: Desolate Land
EVs: 240 SpA / 144 SpD / 124 Spe
Mild Nature
-
Rock Polish
-
Hidden Power Ice
-
Precipice Blades
-
Fire Blast

Freed of Stealth Rock with the support of Arceus-Fairy, this set options for a mixed Rock Polish set. Strong Fire Blast and Hidden Power Ice help disrupt some typical Primal Groudon checks, especially those typically employed by offense such as Mega Salamence, Arceus-Ground, Zygarde-C, and various floaty Pokemon. Unneutered Precipice Blades still hits hard off a monster Attack stat and can dent bulky Water-types along with some SpD walls. Offensive synergy with Primal Kyogre ensures that the team has punish opportunities vs. Pokemon such as Ho-Oh, Arceus-Water, and Giratina-O. From a defensive perspective, Primal Groudon helps to cover Xerneas and Primal Kyogre, and functions as a beatstick Pokemon.



Marshadow

Ability: Technician
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
-
Pursuit
-
Shadow Sneak
-
Spectral Thief
-
Close Combat

As discussed in teambuilding and variations, Marshadow provides Pursuit support, a proactive solution vs. slower setup sweepers, and revenge killing of fast offensive threats via Shadow Sneak. Offense builds, especially in the current metagame, have a strong desire for a fastmon, and Marshadow fills many of these traits, proactively checking several offensive Pokemon. It functions as a gluemon for the team, provided the aforementioned utilities, while also being able to directly threaten some defensive Pokemon as well. Pursuit is run in order to offer some resistance vs. trappers, however even this proactive solution is not ironclad vs. such Pokemon that are impossible to reactively check.



Primal Kyogre

Ability: Primordial Sea
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpA
Brave Nature
-
Ice Beam
-
Thunder
-
Earthquake
-
Liquidation

Many defensive teams, especially in modern generations, fail to adequately check Kyogre. This arises from a mentality of complacency with Primal Groudon, lack of variety in reactive Primal Kyogre checks, and the fact that offense tends to have a built-in advantage thanks to Speed. Because very few defensive Pokemon can manage to wall Primal Kyogre, other members of the build such as Marshadow, Primal Groudon, and Necrozma-DM focus on picking up the offense matchup. The main reason this set is physical is related to matchup vs. Primal Groudon. Earthquake Primal Kyogre is the best proactive way to punish Primal Groudon switch-ins, and the team is strongly motivated in reducing the opportunities opposing Primal Groudon can seize. A set of Substitute + Calm Mind isn’t terrible vs. Primal Groudon however, still gets the job done vs. passive Toxic Pokemon, and is better vs. Ferrothorn. Against builds that option for Arceus-Water as a pivot vs. Primal Kyogre, Substitute can be especially effective.







The list is not exhaustive, and obviously there is some personal debate in regards to what can be considered each of the respective types of checks. I also put these things together rather quickly, so I can get an idea of how the variations trade gaps in coverage.



I hope you've enjoyed this tale with me... Until the next evening... Vale~
 

USUM Psych HO

Banned deucer.
Not sure why my rate was deleted, nor do I really appreciate it but I'll list out what you can change with team again. Running pursuit on Marshadow is not a proactive solution to dealing with STAG at all. If you face a Gengar with Will-O-Wisp, you are running a 50-50 shot of KOing it. The location of Stealth Rock on this team is imperative, and Mixed PDon doesn't seem to fit well, it is criminally overrated (much like this team of course). Your Mega Salamence set is absolutely lackluster, putting too much pressure on it while only running one attacking move. Mega Salamence is your only solution versus a stall team, but even it has its flaws against Celesteela for example. Overall, I have tried this team out, and I must say, while it does decent against some threats, the lack of a true offensive presence truly hinders this team, especially against stall. Lastly, I've noticed that Zygarde can spam Glare to all your mons once MIxed PDon is knocked out, making Sub DD Zygarde an extremely huge threat for this team. My suggestion is to swap your current mixed Kyogre set, which is outclassed in every regard for a Sub CM Primal Kyogre set. Arceus-Fairy would be better suited as a defog user rather than a SR user, you're better of using a Stealth Rock + Swords Dance Variant of PDon - plus you outspeed almost all PDons you run into, making the mirror match favorable. Marshadow doesn't really seem to fit on this team, stick with Yveltal for momentum, personally run the Rash LO Yveltal Set with Sucker Punch. Make Salamence the standard set, it performs best with that set. Lastly, you may want to replace Arceus Fairy with a better defog user such as Xerneas - to increase the offensive presence of this team. The set is up to you, but I'd recommend a cleric defensive Xerneas set along the lines of Moonblast/Defog/Aromatherapy/Toxic with leftovers - totally up to you again. Anyway, this is a semi-solid team, and thanks for sharing it.
 
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Not sure why my rate was deleted, nor do I really appreciate it but I'll list out what you can change with team again. Running pursuit on Marshadow is not a proactive solution to dealing with STAG at all. If you face a Gengar with Will-O-Wisp, you are running a 50-50 shot of KOing it. The location of Stealth Rock on this team is imperative, and Mixed PDon doesn't seem to fit well, it is criminally overrated (much like this team of course). Your Mega Salamence set is absolutely lackluster, putting too much pressure on it while only running one attacking move. Mega Salamence is your only solution versus a stall team, but even it has its flaws against Celesteela for example. Overall, I have tried this team out, and I must say, while it does decent against some threats, the lack of a true offensive presence truly hinders this team, especially against stall. Lastly, I've noticed that Zygarde can spam Glare to all your mons once MIxed PDon is knocked out, making Sub DD Zygarde an extremely huge threat for this team. My suggestion is to swap your current mixed Kyogre set, which is outclassed in every regard for a Sub CM Primal Kyogre set. Arceus-Fairy would be better suited as a defog user rather than a SR user, you're better of using a Stealth Rock + Swords Dance Variant of PDon - plus you outspeed almost all PDons you run into, making the mirror match favorable. Marshadow doesn't really seem to fit on this team, stick with Yveltal for momentum, personally run the Rash LO Yveltal Set with Sucker Punch. Make Salamence the standard set, it performs best with that set. Lastly, you may want to replace Arceus Fairy with a better defog user such as Xerneas - to increase the offensive presence of this team. The set is up to you, but I'd recommend a cleric defensive Xerneas set along the lines of Moonblast/Defog/Aromatherapy/Toxic with leftovers - totally up to you again. Anyway, this is a semi-solid team, and thanks for sharing it.
The team is fine as it is, no need of more Offensive pressure, tested this out and works excelent thanks to Solgaleo set, and PDon Mix, your sugerences about change the Kyogre set to SUB CM makes the team weaker to stall (Blissey) and not fix at all the main issue you named (Zygarde), Arceus Fairy is a switch in to dark types like Yveltal LO, Arceus Dark and other stuff like Marshadow, running Xerneas instead of Arceus Fairy just make the team more weaker to dark spam and more easy to break, including that Ekiller is really a threat without marshadow. To me the team is almost perfect, maybe it has some issues with some stuff, but Stall is not threat to this team and I still play this team without find a really good threat.

Amazing work with this team Minority, Im impressed as always with your team building.
 

USUM Psych HO

Banned deucer.
The team is fine as it is, no need of more Offensive pressure, tested this out and works excelent thanks to Solgaleo set, and PDon Mix, your sugerences about change the Kyogre set to SUB CM makes the team weaker to stall (Blissey) and not fix at all the main issue you named (Zygarde), Arceus Fairy is a switch in to dark types like Yveltal LO, Arceus Dark and other stuff like Marshadow, running Xerneas instead of Arceus Fairy just make the team more weaker to dark spam and more easy to break, including that Ekiller is really a threat without marshadow. To me the team is almost perfect, maybe it has some issues with some stuff, but Stall is not threat to this team and I still play this team without find a really good threat.

Amazing work with this team Minority, Im impressed as always with your team building.
That's absolutely untrue, any good stall player can crush this team. But aside from that, I made a better version of this team that can handle stall somewhat better but still face difficulty with it.
 

Loloartsi

Banned deucer.
dropping some suggestions you could implement, really solid team btw had success with it myself against players that know what they're doing.

The Necrozma-DM set

1514389025013.png
double dance ->
1514389043081.png
trick room+swords dance

Necrozma-Dusk-Mane @ Solganium Z
Ability: Prism Armor
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Sunsteel Strike
- Earthquake
- Swords Dance
- Trick Room

While somewhat similar to the set you already have, I feel Necrozma-DM would fit in your team better as a teamplayer and breaker rather than a standalone sweeper, which this set can still perform somewhat effectively though less effectively than the Double Dance set. As your team otherwise falls short to Geomancy Xerneas and Mega Salamence, you want Necrozma-DM to have as much longevity as possible and the difference between 124 and maximum HP evs is actually huge. Also this team actually benefits a lot from Trick Room support, as it's not that fast-paced aside from Marshadow, you don't have a Choice Scarf user that would heavily dislike this and bonus Trick Room turns help Primal Kyogre a lot in breaking while Primal Groudon doesn't need to Rock Polish. If you do implement this you may consider slower and bulkier spreads for Mega Salamence and Arceus-Fairy.

Arceus-Fairy and Primal Kyogre EV spreads

Arceus-Fairy @ Pixie Plate
Ability: Multitype
EVs: 252 HP / 64 Def / 192 Spe
Timid Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Recover
- Judgment
- Toxic

It's pretty clear that this is the optimal spread since it lets Arceus-Fairy take a +1 dedge from mence which is way better and lets you outspeed everything you need to, the speedtie with max speed Arceus doesn't really help in the 1v1 either.

Kyogre @ Blue Orb
Ability: Drizzle
EVs: 32 HP / 236 Atk / 64 Def / 176 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Liquidation
- Earthquake
- Thunder
- Ice Beam

Ok, my reasoning for this one will be a bit longer lmao. Unless you're implementing the Necrozma-DM change I suggested above, then this is by far the best spread for physical Primal Kyogre. The thing is, with your current spread you get additional bulk which is nice but you're forced out and unable to directly 2HKO threats you are supposed to such as Primal Groudon, as you don't want to eat a Precipice Blades yourself. Especially now with the recent release of Necrozma-DM the benchmarks in the region of 250-260 are more common than ever, so you rather want to outspeed and 2HKO these threats than run away and drop acorns on them until they die (s/o mags lmao). With this spread you hit 260 speed, allowing you to speedcreep most RP Primal Groudon, Geoxern and Necrozma-DM sets. The EVs in HP and Defense let Primal Kyogre take a Brave Bird from Ho-Oh and a Double-Edge from Mega Salamence after Stealth Rock, and finally the Attack EVs give you a good chance to 2HKO max HP Primal Groudon after Stealth Rock. The loss in special attack isn't that big as you don't miss any noteworthy OHKOs with Ice Beam, and dealing with Arceus-Water and opposing Primal Kyogre becomes a tad bit harder but spamming Thunder with it's neat 30% paralysis chance should get the job done anyway.

Facade > Double-Edge on Mega Salamence

I'm not honestly even sure about this myself, but Facade over Double-Edge would be an option if you wanted to stay safe against Mega Gengar (which you have kinda shaky counterplay for) and have a status sponge for Ho-Oh etc. Though you lose most of your offensive presence if you do this and hazard wars become a lot harder for you in general.

So yeah not much I can suggest here, the biggest weakness is probably tspikes stack+sub tect zygarde but hey thats quite uncommon and every team has its weaknesses. Honestly this team looks like something you'd find on samples, really solid and standardish looking build. Nice work Minority :)
 

Minority

Numquam Vincar
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TR Necrozma-DM is certainly an option that's especially harsh vs. opposing offenses and as you said the rest of the team kind of details spreads to accommodate it. Having used the move on a variety of offenses, TR can be run in a one off fashion better than most people might think. I do say it in the teambuilding section, but as a reminder the posted sets are not the real sets because of Speed creep. The actual physical Primal Kyogre spread is closer to what you suggest than what is posted (I just posted the analysis standard at the time). As for trying to fit Facade or another move on Mence, I briefly discuss this in the RMT, but you can replace Dragon Dance with Earthquake, or potentially Facade.

I appreciate the post.
 
Hi Minority. Really like your team. Just curious: what do reactive and proactive checks mean? This is the first time I've came across these terms, and your decision matrix seems like a really interesting tool.
 

Minority

Numquam Vincar
is a Tiering Contributoris a Top Contributoris a Tutor Alumnusis a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus
The terms are commonly used in engineering, and they come from how there are two ways to deal with problems: either do something to fix the problem after it arises (reactive), or you do something that stops the problem before it can ever get started (proactive). If you adequately fireproof a building, you are proactively protecting it from fire. If you install a sprinkler system, you reactively stop the fire should one occur.

You can think of it in a somewhat similar way with Pokemon. Proactive checks disincentive or eliminate your opponent's ability to fully utilize Pokemon X without needing to switch in. Revenge killers are a common example of proactive checks. Another example is if a team has no Pokemon that can be trapped by Gothitelle, thus it proactively checks this threat. Reactive checks are a more direct response to Pokemon X that is most effective upon switch in. For example, Arceus-Fairy may be considered a reactive check to Yveltal. While Arceus-Fairy may disincentive Yveltal use from the opponent, if for only a moment, it's effectiveness comes from its ability to switch in and beat it in an extended 1v1 matchup.

HOs rely very heavily on proactive checks. The reason for this is because HOs, with their focus on offensive synergy, are not able to employ all the Pokemon necessary to reactively switch in vs. all relevant threats. Stalls rely heavily on reactive checks, because the premise of the build is to outlast the opponent, whereas the majority of proactive checks lack staying power. Bulky Offense and Balances sit somewhere in between. I have no hard definition of what constitutes a proactive check vs. a reactive one, but think of it as if the Pokemon can switch in, or if it must rely on an alternative tactic to perform the check. In general, reactive checks provide more options to the player than proactive ones, but the cost is that they tend to yield more momentum.
 

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