Type: Null, Silvally Discussion

I like Type:Null and Silvally if only for their roles on Volt-turn teams. Type:Null being an incredibly bulky slow pivot that can help get things in safely while wearing down with U-turn, while Silvally can actually make use of parting shot due to it's reasonable speed tier, or just chip damage with U-turn.

Fairy, Flying and Dark look the best of its memory typings right now as they are the most spammable STAB's on offer. Possibly rock as well though the other 3 bring slightly better utility on the defensive side (even uninvested base 95's across the board allow some hits to be taken).
 

Colonel M

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Kind of in the "probably UU/BL" camp myself. This thing has laziness written all over it though:

- The Speed stat swaps the 5 and 9 upon evolution. -_-
- Steel Wing? Uh... okay I guess? Guess I get the Tomahawk thing maybe or something but seems odd.
- Moves are all over the place.

It has some potential with its well-balanced stats and, honestly, decent movepool. It's no Arceus for sure, but it has some perks going for it. Fighting Silvally seems passable since it has Rock Slide (Fighting / Rock works good enough) and Crunch to work with it, though other Fighting-types like Infernape and co certainly give it fierce competition. Flying also has potential since it has moves that can work around some of the problematic things Birdspam has (missing Earthquake is kind of crap, though) with Fire Fang, Flamethrower, and Brick Break. Unfortunately, they're rather weak in base power and some like Talonflame and Staraptor (hell even Dodrio now) have an edge on that too. Dragon might be passable too I think. Outside of that, it's hard to really say what's really great. I kind of wish it got Wish, actually, because it would really expand a lot for this mon to be a defensive pivot (Parting Shot and U-turn with well-balanced defenses is pretty cool).

Definitely jack-of-all trades master of none kind of mon, but still a mon that I think turned out better than a lot of Gen 7 mons thus far. Could really use some love in the future hopefully.
 
If this thing manages to get beyond RU, it will be solely because it's the fastest user of parting shot. It has no noteworthy offensive ability as far as I can tell and it lacks the support moves it would need to succeed even if it's bulk were considered passable. Maybe Move Tutors will salvage it, but for now it looks like another shitmon.

As of now, the only set I can imagine being worthwhile is Tri Attack, Parting Shot, Thunderbolt and Ice Beam. It has Thunder Wave, Flash Cannon and Flamethrower if it needs to hit anything specific but it's not worth running if it doesn't have Parting Shot, and it doesn't seem viable at all on the physical side because memories only change your type, and it's not really worth forgoing your item slot to do so even you already essentially have no ability.
 
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Eh... I'm not very happy that this mon can't hold an item outside of its memory and then also the memory doesn't appear to give any boosts outside of the type change. At least arceus got the benefit of a STAB boost thanks to the plates. So we are working with itemless 95/95 offfenses and itemless 95/95/95 defenses, not a good start. seems like a prime candidate for RU where it will offer a range of otherwise unobtainable good-all-round typings that might not otherwise exist (for instance perhaps will be the only decent stat distribution rock type, only decent fast fairy, fast steel wallbreaker/sweeper, etc etc.)
 
Silvally @ Fairy Memory
Ability: RKS System
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Multi-Attack
- Parting Shot
- Swords Dance
- Filler

A Fairy with 95 in everything, a good reliable physical Fairy move, and Parting Shot has plenty of potential to be viable.

Maybe not a dominating force, but certainly usable. Steel is another good type for it, and it's also able to learn Draco Meteor.

Think of it as a gluemon to patch up holes in your team.
 

Colonel M

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So memories only give a type change with no additional bonus like the plates do? Bummer. That might make this mon even more crippled than what it already is.
 
ok, cool

so something faster and bulkier gets the only thing it could possibly make use of
silvally confirmed for unusable shitmon
Eh, it's basically a failed clone of Arceus. Main thing it has going for it is being able to bring any type to your team that has decent bulk. We've seen unpredictability make certain pokemon ban-list before. (Lucario, for example)
 
Silvally @ Bug Memory
Ability: RKS System
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpAtk / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- U-Turn
- Flamethrower
- Ice Beam
- Thunderbolt

Mini-Genesect for UU or below: threaten a lot of switches with powerful coverage, then hit them with a STAB U-Turn and retain momentum. Needs hazard removal support ofc but it could be decent.
 
95/95/95/95/95/95 isn't that much lower than Pokemon like Jirachi, Manaphy, and Victini.

Saying this thing will be a shitmon is a huge exaggeration. It's basically one of those Pokemon, except it trades 5 points in each stat for the ability to be any type.
Except it has none of the moves, items, or abilities that make those mons good. To be a Water-type, for example type, it forgoes its item and its ability and in exchange it gains a more accurate Aqua Tail. In comparison, to be a Water-type, Manaphy forgoes fucking nothing and can choose between things like Lefties or LO if it so chooses and can choose to be functionally immune to statuses. That's like saying Chlorophyll Venusaur is (or was) comparable to Meganium.
 
Eh... I'm not very happy that this mon can't hold an item outside of its memory and then also the memory doesn't appear to give any boosts outside of the type change. At least arceus got the benefit of a STAB boost thanks to the plates. So we are working with itemless 95/95 offfenses and itemless 95/95/95 defenses, not a good start. seems like a prime candidate for RU where it will offer a range of otherwise unobtainable good-all-round typings that might not otherwise exist (for instance perhaps will be the only decent stat distribution rock type, only decent fast fairy, fast steel wallbreaker/sweeper, etc etc.)
Wait... what? It HAS to hold a memory?
 

Pikachu315111

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I was kind of expecting a bit more in stats, or at least 600 BST.

Type: Null will most certainly be banned from Little Cup but that's alright, as a pre-evolution it still gets some benefits such as Eviolite making it a pretty mighty wall (on top of Battle Armor preventing Crit hax).
It even has some utilities such as Scary Face, Metal Sound, Heal Block, Toxic, Protect, Thunder Wave, U-turn, and Substitute. But let's not ignore those good offense stats. And being a chimera of sorts it learns plenty of moves. Some STAB options (mainly Tri Attack and Double-Edge/Return), Pursuit/Punishment/Payback, Air Slash/Aerial Ace, X-Scissor, Iron Head, Dragon Claw, Shadow Claw, and Rock Slide.
Send it out to wall, dish out some damage, and when its low on HP either U-turn or let it faint. That is what it's like to be considered nothing.

So onto the main show: Silvally... and I was expecting more. Alright, its faster, but none of its stats are above that benchmark 100 making it feel like it falls short (which make me wonder if this is due to being used as a boss in the game). And thoguh we joke it's "Arceus Lite", it doesn't get some key moves to really run any sets Arceus can.
A physical or mixed set will probably rely Multi-Attack most of the time as its STAB so that's covered. It also adds elemental fangs (including Poison Fang), Crunch, Ice Beam, Thunderbolt, Shadow Ball, Flamethrower, Steel Wing (How? From its wing-like horn?), Flash Cannon, and Surf. You'll notice they actually went out of their way for it to not learn the high powered moved like Blizzard, Thunder, Fire Blast, Solar Beam, Earthquake, or Stone Edge; though it does get Draco Meteor but that's more from that being accessible to any Dragon-type. It also a got few more utilities like Parting Shot and Explosion.
With under 100 Speed and no Eviolite boost, Silvally kind of feels it lost more then gained. It's not bad, it has nice bulk and offensive power and with a Scarf can probably fix one of its hold backs, but that would mean you lose its type changing gimmick. It kind of feels like they did want to make a mini-Arceus but were afraid of making it "too" good.

Hm, do you think maybe Arceus could get Multi-Attack? I think it would like it.
 
some1 prolly posted this already, but what about thunder wave + sd ala groudon? grass silv could probably use it best alongside rock slide (with zone support for obvious reasons) but i could see other types (water immediately comes to mind) pulling it off too. thunder wave in general seems like a great option on this thing bc it can swat away electrics AND grounds with its type flexibility.

metal sound doesn't sound too out there, either. water has the best natural coverage for this set, and should hit hard enough with coverage moves to stunt on fat stuff like ferro and toxapex. i mean, chansey walls, but we're not banning dugtrio anytime soon, so it'd be a pretty braindead 'n effective partner.
 
Decided to check out a type chart and find out the ideal set of coverage moves for each Swords Dance Set. Most of these are probably not ideal since Parting shot and other Utility moves like Thunder Wave are likely much better than any coverage move swords dance sets can run due to these moves giving silvally much more early game utility. However, some specific swords Dance sets may appreciate running all coverage moves.
Silvally @ Life Orb
Ability: RKS System
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Crunch
- Double-Edge
- Explosion / Fire Fang / Iron Head

Crunch and Double Edge basically get perfect coverage on all Single type Pokemon. Explosion hits stuff extremely hard, though Fire Fang / Iron Head can cover specific Pokemon that resist both Normal and Dark like Lucario and Diancie. Doubt either move is worth giving up explosion though. Dugtrio or Magneton / zone support might be appreciated for this set, though I think it will do just fine as a lure for most Steel-types thanks to Explosion.
Silvally @ Fire Memory
Ability: RKS System
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Multi-Attack
- Ice Fang / Iron Head
- Thunder Fang / Rock Slide

Multi-Attack, Ice Fang, and Thunder Fang hit 10 out of the 18 Types super effectively, giving Silvally great super effective coverage. Issue is that Silvally really can't do crap against pokemon that resist Multi attack and are neutral to Ice and Thunder Fang. Iron Head and Rock Slide have worse super effective coverage, but hit targets, specifically Rock and Fire types, much harder.

Silvally @ Water Memory
Ability: RKS System
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Multi-Attack
- Ice Fang / Double Edge
- Thunder Fang / Double Edge

Ice Fang and Thunder Fang hit almost all of water's resist super effectively. Double Edge could be an option over one of these moves however, as it hits water resist for neutral damage and its significantly higher base Power offset's its lack of coverage. Fire Fang might have some use too, as it prevents silvally from being completely walled by ferrothorn.

Silvally @ Grass Memory
Ability: RKS System
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Multi-Attack
- Double Edge
- Fire Fang

Grass silvally is one of silvally's forms that is most hurt by the lack of EQ, as it would have helped so much in dealing with Steel, Poison, and Fire-types. At the very least, a boosted double edge is still strong enough to deal heft damage to slower Bug, poison and Fire types after they take a bit of prior damage. Fire Fang is used to hit steel-types, while also scoring super effective damage against Grass and Bug types.

Silvally @ Electric Memory
Ability: RKS System
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Multi-Attack
- Ice Fang
- Double Edge

Multi-attack + Ice Fang get perfect Bolt Beam coverage. Double Edge is there to hit pokemon that resist the combo or are neutral to Ice Fang for decent damage.

Silvally @ Ice Memory
Ability: RKS System
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Multi-Attack
- Thunder Fang
- Fire Fang


Similar to the last set except with STAB on Ice Multi Attack rather than electric. Fire Fang is probably the best option in the last slot so that silvally can at least scratch Steel-types.
Silvally @ Fighting Memory
Ability: RKS System
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Multi-Attack
- Iron Head
- Crunch


Iron Head and Crunch deal super effective damage to virtually every fighting resist. Might be worth running rock slide / Ice Fang to hit Bulky Flying-types like Zapdos, but its not like they will be phazed by the moves due to their low BP.
Silvally @ Poison Memory
Ability: RKS System
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Multi-Attack
- Crunch
- Fire Fang / Ice Fang / Iron head


Poison is really terrible for an offensive typing and Silvally unfortunately lack the coverage to deal with most of its resist. Crunch at least gives good neutral coverage against most poison resist and Fire Fang, Ice Fang, or Iron Head can hit one of its resist for super effective damage. Heavily appreciates support from Dugtrio and Magneton / zone.
Silvally @ Ground Memory
Ability: RKS System
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Multi-Attack
- Ice Fang
- Rock Slide

Ground has super good neutral coverage and silvally luckily has the moves to hit most ground resist for super effective damage. Ice Fang and Rock Slide basically hit all ground resist and immunties for super effective damage, barring a few exceptionss like Eelektross.
Silvally @ Flying Memory
Ability: RKS System
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Multi-Attack
- Iron Head
- Fire Fang

Another Silvally form that would have loved to have earthquake in its arsenal. Iron Head and Fire Fang are unfortunately its best defense against Steel and Rock Pokemon. Crunch might be used on this set to give Silvally better neutral coverage in 2 moves, allowing it to run parting shot in the last slot.
Silvally @ Psychic Memory
Ability: RKS System
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Multi-Attack
- X-Scissors / U-Turn
- Fire Fang / Crunch

One of Silvally's more interesting forms. X-Scissors and U-Turn hit Dark and Psychic-types for super effective damage while Fire Fang hits Steel-types for super effective damage. Crunch could be a good option too since it has good neutral coverage agianst most foes and can scare away slower ghost-types.
Silvally @ Rock Memory
Ability: RKS System
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Multi-Attack
- Ice Fang
- Fire Fang

Yet another form hurt by the lack of Earthquake. Fire Fang and Ice Fang can at least hit Steel and Ground-types super effectively while also denting specific Grass-types like Breloom.
Silvally @ Bug Memory
Ability: RKS System
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Multi-Attack
- Iron Head
- Crunch

Bug unfortunately just had too many resist for silvally to deal with in a single SD set. Crunch + Iron head hit Ghost and Rock-types super effectively while hitting all bug resist for neutral damage. U-Turn or Fire Fang might be decent options over Iron Head as well.

Silvally @ Ghost Memory
Ability: RKS System
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Multi-Attack
- X-Scissor
- Filler

Since Ghost STAB has such good neutral coverage, ghost silvally barely need to rely on its coverage moves. X-Scissors hits Dark-types for super effective damage and last slot really depends on your teams needs.

Silvally @ Dragon Memory
Ability: RKS System
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Multi-Attack
- Iron Head
- Fire Fang

Very Straightforward. Multi-Attack hits most targets for solid damage, Iron Head and Fire Fang hit Steel and Fairies that resist Multi-Attack while also doing fair damage to most Ice Types. Support from Dugtrio or Magneton / zone would probably be ideal for this set.

Silvally @ Dark Memory
Ability: RKS System
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Multi-Attack
- Double Edge
- Fire Fang

Another Silvally form that gets good coverage with its STAB alone. Double Edge is the best coverage move to use, as it hits many of Dark's resist good damage thanks to its high base power. Fire Fang is used to hit specific resist like Lucario.

Silvally @ Steel Memory
Ability: RKS System
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Multi-Attack
- Crunch
- Fire Fang / Double Edge

Crunch hits almost all of Multi-Attacks's resist for neutral damage. Fire Fang hits Steel-types who can usually take a boosted Crunch for good damage (specifically Magneton) while Double edge can deal respectable damage to bulkier Water, Fire, and Electric-types.

Silvally @ Steel Memory
Ability: RKS System
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Multi-Attack
- Double Edge
- Fire Fang

Another Silvally form screwed over by the lack of Earthquake. Oh well. Double Edge deals respectable damage to most poison and Fire types after a boost while Fire Fang can dent most steel-types. Probably would benefit from Magneton / zone support.
 

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