I personally think that either one or two is appropriate given our design and stat line. Bugs do tend to have two evolutions for the most part, but I can see this being in the same vein as Volcarona or Crustle.
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CAP 28 - Prevo # Discussion
- Thread starter Quanyails
- Start date
- Status
I'm in the None camp at this point. The design is great, and I think it works great as a standalone eidea much like Turtonator, and Drampa. I think there's a bit of options that can be done if we go for a single prevo, but I'm not really feeling it flavor wise (unless we justified it as a version exclusive against Astro or something entirely flavorful).
Personally, I'm in favor of none, because it just looks simple enough as it is. I don't really see a need for one here.
I also kinda disagree with the BST argument that has been brought up. The argument that a Pokemon with our BST would have a prevo kinda falls flat to me when a real Pokemon would not have our BST in the first place. The only pokemon with BSTs above Arcanine and below the pseudo legends are legendary pokemon that have no prevos, and Archeops, who I would argue is a weird special case due to its hindering ability, and not some hard precedent. And if we accept that our BST is unrealistic no matter what we pick, we should instead compare ourselves to guys a bit lower down in the 500s. And that includes Pokemon like Lapras and Duraludon, Rotom and Cryogonal. Not to mention our own Revenankh, Mollux and Crucibelle
None of this is to say that an evolution is necessarily a bad pick. Rather, I just think that the idea that our BST somehow implies evolution is a flawed metric when our BST is unrealistic in the first place and has little precedent at all. We should just pick whatever we think makes sense from the design, BST be damned. And to me, that means we should have none.
I also kinda disagree with the BST argument that has been brought up. The argument that a Pokemon with our BST would have a prevo kinda falls flat to me when a real Pokemon would not have our BST in the first place. The only pokemon with BSTs above Arcanine and below the pseudo legends are legendary pokemon that have no prevos, and Archeops, who I would argue is a weird special case due to its hindering ability, and not some hard precedent. And if we accept that our BST is unrealistic no matter what we pick, we should instead compare ourselves to guys a bit lower down in the 500s. And that includes Pokemon like Lapras and Duraludon, Rotom and Cryogonal. Not to mention our own Revenankh, Mollux and Crucibelle
None of this is to say that an evolution is necessarily a bad pick. Rather, I just think that the idea that our BST somehow implies evolution is a flawed metric when our BST is unrealistic in the first place and has little precedent at all. We should just pick whatever we think makes sense from the design, BST be damned. And to me, that means we should have none.
One, its design reminds me more of Escavalier, Accelgor, and Crustle than single-stage bugs like Pinsir and Shuckle.
I would like either One or None. Our design is definitely not the most complex, but I think our talented artists have the ability to create a fun prevo that stands out for this one. I wouldn’t be opposed to Two as it’s quite fitting of the Bug and Dragon types, but I definitely prefer to have less.
I'd go with none. Seems like it would be a one shot like Durant personally.
Definitely think one. We are very similar in the stat department to Volcarona and design-wise to Noivern. We could do a similarly pitiful prevo (or make it busted in CAPLC).
Just as an addendum to what jas said because this argument bothers me too since I've been seeing it for the best few caps now, if people really think a high BST is all that it takes to justify a prevo than CAP might as well just automatically start assuming one prevo for all future projects since caps have much higher stat bloat than an official mon. Starters aside there hasn't been a "low" bst cap in a very long time and I don't think that's something that's going to change anytime soon.
This looks like a One to me. With that giant maw, it definitely looks like it would evolve from a weaker bug, that isn't something you'd usually see all around in the wild. It also has rather high stats for a single-state mon.
What CAP doesn't have high BST? We artificially inflate them to keep them competitively viable. If we justify prevos based on BST, every single one of them should have a prevo. I'm in the none camp. I have trouble picturing a prevo for this. Heck, I'm down to declare this sucker a pseudo-legendary, for that matter. It feels like something you'd only find one of. That'd rationalize both the BST and the no evo.
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For those arguing for or against the BST argument, here are just some comparative BSTs for thought:
This would be our new highest single stage cap if we vote for Zero.
There have been a few arguments about how if we fall back on BST as an argument, that most CAPs would fall above the line. However, if we look at the limits already imposed by Gamefreak for 8 generations or our own current maximum:
It is also worth mentioning that the only CAPs with a higher BST than 28's 569 are Aurumoth, Jumbao, Krillowatt, and Kerfluffle.
Arcanine -550 BST - Highest BST of a non-(pseudo)-legendary Pokemon without a drawback ability
Snorlax - 540 BST - Highest BST of a non-legendary Pokemon that can hatch from an egg (single stage until Gen IV)
Lapras - 535 BST - Highest BST of a single stage non-legendary Pokemon
As for some example CAPs that are single stage:
Pajantom - 551
Crucibelle - 540
Mollux - 535
Revenankh - 525
Snorlax - 540 BST - Highest BST of a non-legendary Pokemon that can hatch from an egg (single stage until Gen IV)
Lapras - 535 BST - Highest BST of a single stage non-legendary Pokemon
As for some example CAPs that are single stage:
Pajantom - 551
Crucibelle - 540
Mollux - 535
Revenankh - 525
This would be our new highest single stage cap if we vote for Zero.
There have been a few arguments about how if we fall back on BST as an argument, that most CAPs would fall above the line. However, if we look at the limits already imposed by Gamefreak for 8 generations or our own current maximum:
Snorlax's 540/Lapras' 535 as a theoretical maximum, the following (non-Starter) CAPs would still fall under that line:
Pyroak - 540
Stratagem - 535
Kitsunoh - 513
Tomohawk - 535
Malaconda - 500
Cawmodore - 530
If we were to look at Pajantom's 551 as an arbitrary upper bound:
Cyclohm - 548
Voodoom - 550
Necturna - 547
Equilibra - 547
Pyroak - 540
Stratagem - 535
Kitsunoh - 513
Tomohawk - 535
Malaconda - 500
Cawmodore - 530
If we were to look at Pajantom's 551 as an arbitrary upper bound:
Cyclohm - 548
Voodoom - 550
Necturna - 547
Equilibra - 547
It is also worth mentioning that the only CAPs with a higher BST than 28's 569 are Aurumoth, Jumbao, Krillowatt, and Kerfluffle.
I'm going to argue that one is the best choice, and that none is not ideal.
There are very few bug pokemon that do not evolve. These are Pinsir, Shuckle, Heracross, Volbeat/Illumise, and Durant. What these all have in common is that they do not have much to iterate on, especially the small ones such as Shuckle and Volbeat/Illumise. You can argue that Pinsir and Heracross can iterate on their horns as a concept, but if you look at them from a design standpoint, there is very little in their concept already to iterate on. I can't see this design being as simple as any of the aforementioned Pokemon, especially with the clear themes it has. In fact, I would even argue that two would be fine given this design is on the same caliber as the likes of many early-route bugmons, especially Vikavolt.
Why do so little bug pokemon not evolve? The answer could stem from the creation of Pokemon itself. Pokemon, as a series, has always been about the concept of evolving monsters, and what better animals can you base a monster off of than a bug, known for their ability to metamorphose? I believe that this is why bug-types in Pokemon always try to iterate in some form, especially when compared to other types of animals such as mammals and birds which generally do not undergo such a huge shift in appearance.
For those that can't see this design iterating don't seem to understand the potential a bug has when evolving. This design has a very substantial amount of design aspects to build up to, especially that of its tail and armor-like body. Look at Pokemon like Vikavolt. It has a very clear progression in evolution and tells a story with it. I am 100% sure this design can pull something like that off, and it kind of bothers me that people here don't seem to have the mental creativity to see that it has that potential.
A very opinionated take from me, but not having it evolve would do this design and bug-types in general a huge disservice just because it looks "fine as is".
There are very few bug pokemon that do not evolve. These are Pinsir, Shuckle, Heracross, Volbeat/Illumise, and Durant. What these all have in common is that they do not have much to iterate on, especially the small ones such as Shuckle and Volbeat/Illumise. You can argue that Pinsir and Heracross can iterate on their horns as a concept, but if you look at them from a design standpoint, there is very little in their concept already to iterate on. I can't see this design being as simple as any of the aforementioned Pokemon, especially with the clear themes it has. In fact, I would even argue that two would be fine given this design is on the same caliber as the likes of many early-route bugmons, especially Vikavolt.
Why do so little bug pokemon not evolve? The answer could stem from the creation of Pokemon itself. Pokemon, as a series, has always been about the concept of evolving monsters, and what better animals can you base a monster off of than a bug, known for their ability to metamorphose? I believe that this is why bug-types in Pokemon always try to iterate in some form, especially when compared to other types of animals such as mammals and birds which generally do not undergo such a huge shift in appearance.
For those that can't see this design iterating don't seem to understand the potential a bug has when evolving. This design has a very substantial amount of design aspects to build up to, especially that of its tail and armor-like body. Look at Pokemon like Vikavolt. It has a very clear progression in evolution and tells a story with it. I am 100% sure this design can pull something like that off, and it kind of bothers me that people here don't seem to have the mental creativity to see that it has that potential.
A very opinionated take from me, but not having it evolve would do this design and bug-types in general a huge disservice just because it looks "fine as is".
I'm seeing a lot of "this Pokemon could have a prevo" but just because it could doesn't mean it should. I think judging off of the art, there is no reason this Pokemon should have a prevo. However I do understand the argument that it has some unusually high stats for being a single stage Pokemon but there are plenty of single stage Pokemon with a high stat that resembles ours. 
, 
, 
, 
, 
, and 
are just the bug and dragon type examples. I strongly feel that a prevo would be out of place with this little beetle so I think None is the only way to go.
, , , , , and are just the bug and dragon type examples. I strongly feel that a prevo would be out of place with this little beetle so I think None is the only way to go.
I think One pre-evolution would fit best. Its design is complicated enough where it would feel natural to have a simplified version, and it has the same energy of 
and 
. I could definitely see None as an option as well (similar to , , , and ), but one prevo makes more sense based on past pokemon and stats.
and . I could definitely see None as an option as well (similar to , , , and ), but one prevo makes more sense based on past pokemon and stats.- Status