Furry Mexican Duck-Frog (Ludicolo Discussion)

floppybeef82


Ludicolo #272
Let's face it, this guy is just plain sexy.

80 HP / 70 Atk / 70 Def / 90 SpAtk / 100 SpDef / 70 Spd / 480 Total

2x Weakness: Flying, Poison, Bug
1/2x Weakness: Ground, Steel
1/4x Weakness: Water

Flying and Bug are pretty popular, but I think a +Def-natured Ludicolo could stand up to some of the most-used Flying/Bug moves, i.e. Aerial Ace, Megahorn, maybe even Brave Bird.

Abilities:
Swift Swim: When Rain Dance is in effect, Ludicolo's Speed is doubled
Rain Dish: When Rain Dance is in effect, Ludicolo recovers 1/16th of it's max hitpoints

Physical Movepool:
Razor Leaf
Rock Climb
Waterfall
Rock Smash
Strength
Natural Gift
Giga Impact
Drain Punch
Fling
Thief
Secret Power
Brick Break
Facade
Return
Frustration
Bullet Seed
Focus Punch
Astonish
Fake Out
Fury Swipes
Zen Headbutt

Special Movepool:
Absorb/Mega Drain/Giga Drain
Uproar
Hydro Pump
Water Pulse
Hidden Power
Ice Beam
Blizzard
Solar Beam
Energy Ball
Grass Knot
Surf

Support Movepool:
Synthesis
Leech Seed
Tickle
Sweet Scent
Substitute
Swagger
Rest / Sleep Talk
Captivate
Endure
Rain Dance/ Sunny Day/ Hail
Toxic
Protect

I think this guy has some pretty great defenses with decent special attack and speed. With his awesome abilities and great movepool (plus his cool-factor), I'm surprised we don't see this guy more often.

Survival Set
Ludicolo @Leftovers
Bold (+Def, - Atk) – Rain Dish
EVs: 252 SpDef / 252 HP / 6 Def
Move 1 : Leech Seed
Move 2 : Synthesis / Protect / Toxic
Move 3 : Rain Dance
Move 4 : Energy Ball / Giga Drain / Astonish / Hydro Pump / Surf

Rain Dance activates Rain Dish, which (with leftovers) is restoring 1/8th of your HP every turn, PLUS Leech Seed. With Rain Dance activated, I believe Synthesis only restores a max of 1/3rd Ludicolo's max HP...which is still pretty decent, but you might want the all-powerful Protect over it, or Toxic to further annoy.
Quite a few choices for your last slot here: Energy Ball is 120 BP with STAB...Giga Drain hits 90 BP with STAB, and is added healing to make Ludicolo even more annoying...Astonish is a very weak 30 physical BP ghost attack, but with 100% accuracy and a 30% chance for flinching...adding that flinch to the rest of Ludicolo's moveset could be pretty damn annoying. Assuming Rain Dance multiplies Water's BP by 1.5 (I'm pretty sure this is true, please correct me if i'm wrong), Hydro Pump will be sitting at 240 BP, but with that annoying 80% accuracy and 5 PP...Surf, on the other hand, jumps up to 190 BP, with a solid 100% accuracy and 15 PP.
Obviously your opponent is really going to want to get rid of your Rain Dance since it's helping your Ludicolo so much, but good luck switching in any rock/ground type pokemon to use Sandstorm when Ludicolo's got that boosted Hydro Pump or Surf.


Special Attacker
Ludicolo @Leftovers / Wisdom Glasses
Modest (+SAtk, -Atk) – Swift Swim
EVs: 252 SpAtk / 252 HP / 6 Spd
Move 1 : Rain Dance
Move 2 : Energy Ball
Move 3 : Surf
Move 4 : Ice Beam

Rain Dance for that nice speed boost, Energy Ball / Surf for STAB, and Ice Beam to take care of flyers, though I think something like Hidden Power Fire/Psychic could be equally effective for covering bug / poison weakness.

So yeah, discuss Ludicolo, I’d like to see some other creative movesets or just general comments :D
 
Allosteric

Allosteric

Ludicolo is the pinnacle of Pokemon design. Seriously, just look at it. It's the most awesome thing ever. Man, I wish they were all this cool.

Aesthetics aside, I have a couple comments about your Survival set. First, I think Giga Drain should be an option for the last slot. Second, Synthesis is weakened in Rain Dance, not powered up. You're thinking of Sunny Day. Sure, it'll still recover HP, but I'd personally put something like Dive, Toxic, or even Protect on there.
 

floppybeef82

Thanks Allosteric, adjusted accordingly.

I think either of the Ludicolo's sets I mentioned coupled with Toxicroak would make a nice Frog-themed 2v2 pair.


Toxicroak @Black Sludge
Adamant (+Atk, -SAtk) – Dry Skin
EVs: 252 Attack, 252 HP, 6 Speed
Move 1 : Rain Dance / Earthquake
Move 2 : Cross Chop
Move 3 : Stone Edge
Move 4 : Poison Jab


Dry Skin will make Toxicroak restore HP in the rain, plus Black Sludge, so I believe Toxicroak and Ludicolo will both be restoring 1/8th HP each turn (unless Black Sludge is better than Leftovers for poison types? I can't recall). He's got some pretty decent type-coverage, and covers Ludicolo's weaknesses well. Rain Dance on Toxicroak so if your opponent decides to try and switch the weather, you can choose which of your froggies will reuse Rain Dance. If you don't feel another RD is necessary, replace it with EQ.

This actually sounds like a lot of fun, lol
 

SilverWolf

It might be better if a more tankish pokemon such as Bronzong set up Rain Dance with a wet rock. But regardless, I adore Ludicolo. I've been using a much more tankish/stalling set:

Ludicolo @ Leftovers
Rain Dish
Calm
~Seismic Toss
~Leech Seed
~Protect
~Toxic
EV's: 156 HP/176 Sp Def/176 Def

I know toxistalling has more or less died out, but between toxic/leech seed, the opponent's HP drains at an alarming rate, and while I keep up with protect, mine stays pretty high. ST is to prevent me from getting walled by special sweepers using substitute such as Raikou. This Ludi can come in on just about any bulky water and make it cry, and also just owns special walls like Regice. The extra defense allows me to take some hard hits from the other side of the spectrum and still leech/protect in an attempt to survive.

I like it, even though it gets beat up by steels and 101 subs pretty easily.
 

cresselium

SilverWolf said:
It might be better if a more tankish pokemon such as Bronzong set up Rain Dance with a wet rock.
Click to expand...
Agreed. Ludicolo's just a little too frail for Rain Dancing, with the more aggressive metagame.

That's why when I use Ludicolo, I just go for Surf/Toxic or Grass Knot/Leech Seed/Protect. It beats the conventional bulky waters and gives Blissey something to cry about.
 

Tinnacious

cresselium said:
Agreed. Ludicolo's just a little too frail for Rain Dancing, with the more aggressive metagame.

That's why when I use Ludicolo, I just go for Surf/Toxic or Grass Knot/Leech Seed/Protect. It beats the conventional bulky waters and gives Blissey something to cry about.
Click to expand...
Ludicolo can set up in a Raindancing team. I mean, first it Rain Dances, then it tries to take as many Pokemon down as possible. Then when it goes down, send out Azumarill and CB Aqua Jet everything under the rain. With Ludicolo providing the rain and longer duration, Azumarill can be a total beast with his support.
 

firewater

yeah, i know I used it on emerald, (and imported it), but I forgot the Ev's- so I may reset it- and try this instead-

Ludicolo @ Leftovers
Calm
Surf
Ice Beam
Leech Seed
Fake Out/Giga Drain/Sub/Rain Dance

Ev's- 252 hp, 196 sp. def, rest in Sp.atk

basically, i make it a special wall- but it does seem useable now?
(but I don't want to waste my Energy Ball TM, as i've used up my Grass Rope one already)
 
McGrrr

McGrrr

Facetious
is a Contributor Alumnus
Ludicolo is :limecool: maybehaps even :pineapplecool: I was planning to use it on one team or another. It clears sandstream, makes a good Starmie/Manaphy counter, and a half decent Gyarados wall too.

This topic is pretty bad, so I am going to reserve Ludicolo in the analysis forum and write something better.
 

floppybeef82

McGraw said:
This topic is pretty bad, so I am going to reserve Ludicolo in the analysis forum and write something better.
Click to expand...
hooray, only reason i made this topic is cuz i couldnt find it in the analysis forum. and yeah its a pretty half-assed topic, sorry =/
 

Sir Spanky

Energy Ball
Ice Beam
Synthesis
Leech Seed

Worked really nicely in advanced (with HP Grass), but Synthesis is becoming less and less viable with Tyranitar/Hippo, so perhaps something like Surf/Substitute/Rest instead could be more useful.
 

floppybeef82

SirSpanky said:
Energy Ball
Ice Beam
Synthesis
Leech Seed

Worked really nicely in advanced (with HP Grass), but Synthesis is becoming less and less viable with Tyranitar/Hippo, so perhaps something like Surf/Substitute/Rest instead could be more useful.
Click to expand...
Well, Rain Dance will override Sandstream, but it does kinda suck to lose a move just for that.
 

floppybeef82

How much does Rain Dance boost water moves by? I had thought it was 50%, but someone just told me it was only 10%. Clarification?
 

harle1012000

Posted these in an older discussion.
Special Colo
Ludicolo*Choice Specs
Energy Ball
Hydro Pump
Ice Beam
Focus Bomb

Physicolo
Ludicolo*Leftovers
Subsitute
Swords Dance
Thunder Punch/Waterfall
Focus Punch/Ice Punch/Zen Headbutt
 

Pyr0

Appart from all the obvius stuff...

I recently saw this Uber-oriented Ludicolo that ran Surf AND Solarbeam (along with Substitute and my guess for 4rth move was leech seed)
It was used in a SunnyTeam to abuse Solar Beam but also to counter any incomming Kyogre, walling it with teh Subseed and 1/4 resistance to water.

And I tought it was a pretty clever way of using him.
 

TempestJG

The shadow knight said:
I'm quite sure it's 50%
Click to expand...
while I'm 100% sure it's a 1.5x boost.
it's also a .5x boost to fire moves.

comment on the Uber-oriented Ludi, if he was in a Sunny Team, his Surf would be weaker than if they didn't have STAB at all.

STAB (1.5x) and Sunny Day (.5x) equals a .75x boost to his Surf.
 
The Shadow Knight

The Shadow Knight

TempestJG said:
while I'm 100% sure it's a 1.5x boost.
it's also a .5x boost to fire moves.

comment on the Uber-oriented Ludi, if he was in a Sunny Team, his Surf would be weaker than if they didn't have STAB at all.

STAB (1.5x) and Sunny Day (.5x) equals a .75x boost to his Surf.
Click to expand...
That's what I meant I just wanted to build further on the quote.Thank you for the correction anyway.
 
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