Stall in NU - CCAT

[Raseri]

Alright if I counted that right it is 6-5-1 in favour of Omanyte. That means Omanyte will be the second Pokemon on our team.


that means our current team is

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Tropius @ Sitrus Berry
Trait: Harvest
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 Spd
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Leech Seed
- Protect
- Substitute
- Air Slash

Omanyte @ Eviolite
Shell Armor
252HP/252Def/4Spdef
Bold (+Def -Atk)
~ Scald
~ Spikes
~ Stealth Rock
~Toxic

You may now begin nominations for a third pokemon to add to the team, these nominations will remain open for about a week or until activity dies completely.

 

[canno]

Can we switch Stealth Rocks with Toxic Spikes on Omanyte and use Camerupt as our Stealth Rocker? I think it would be more effective this way.

Camerupt @ Leftovers
Trait: Solid Rock
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Stealth Rock
- Earth Power
- Lava Plume
- Roar

This set finishes off our FWG core. However, unlike Flareon, my previous suggestion, Camerupt has an immunity to Electric-type attacks, something we can take neutrally at best at the moment. Lava Plume can burn pokemon, Earth Power is nice STAB, and Roar gives us a phazer. If we are forced to keep Stealth Rock on Omanyte, then replace Stealth Rock with Toxic. Synergy wise, Tropius takes those Water- and Ground-type moves that threaten Camerupt, while Camerupt can absorb Electric-type attacks that threaten Omastar and to an extent Tropius. It's also a good answer to Magmortar, who currently threatens our team to an extent.

 

[Raseri]

If a lot of people want to switch Stealth Rocks to Toxic Spikes we can put it to a vote, we need a few more people to request it though

 

[Cherub Agent]

I'd request using Toxic Spikes on Omanyte as well. Camerupt is a great SRer, and it makes sense to use each Pokeon to its strengths. My original Wish was to use Flareon, but having two FWG core Pokemon weak to SR is undesirable. It's a much better counter to Magmortar, but Camerupt does just fine too. Flareon also doesn't synergise that well with Omanyte, apart from the defensive stats, as both have a Ground-type resistance, and Flareon's Wishes are rather small. Gonna support the Reptile again.

 

[Machineae]

Completely agree with the above post ^

 

[Raseri]

I see no harm in allowing a vote on whether to have Stealth Rock or Toxic Spikes. And after some thought and discussion I feel that it is worth it.

So in order to decide what the fourth move on Omanyte's moveset should be just bold the one you want and explain why. Any post that has no reasoning will be deleted.

So boldvote either Stealth Rock or Toxic Spikes. This will be a quick vote and will close in roughly 48 hours, so make sure you vote before then!

 

[canno]

Toxic Spikes

Toxic Spikes are great on a stall team. It allows us to spread poison to multiple pokemon and allows us to stall and kill them much easier. While Stealth Rock is also amazing, it's much easier to use another Stealth Rocker than to not have Toxic Spikes. Most of the pokemon that learn Toxic Spikes also learn Spikes (as such is the case with Omanyte), while not many pokemon learn just Toxic Spikes alone (and the ones that due either have synergy problems or are as bulky as a wet piece of paper with a rip in it) Meanwhile, there are a sufficient list of Stealth Rockers we can use to lay them up (Camerupt, Armaldo, Golem, Gigalith, ect.), and we even get more variety since it doesn't need to double up as a bird counter (Omanyte does that very well). Overall, Toxic Spikes seem much more useful on Omanyte than Stealth Rock.

 

[Ewil]

Toxic Spikes

Omanyte have the opportunity to set both spikes and t-spikes leaving the duty of SR setter to a better pokemon since there are a lot of SRer and very few spiker/t-spiker. So anyone have his job and i think that the best job for Omanyte is to set both spikes and (maybe) Camerupt can be the SR setter since he can tank a lot of threats primarly Magmortar.
For the rest: The Reptile explain all the reasons.

 

[Machineae]

Toxic Spikes

SR is much more common than Toxic Spikes and as such we'll be able to fit SR on the team easier than the much needed T-Spikes. A stall team would appreciate the status a lot. There aren't too many pokes with t-spikes and those that do have it would not synergize well with a stall team IMO, Omanyte is really the only good setter for stall.

 

[Full2Half]

Toxic Spikes

Not very many pokemon can reliably set up toxic spikes in the NU tier. And although they may be a bit difficult to keep up due to the prevelance of grounded poisons, toxic spikes are an asset to most stall teams. As well as the number of good SR setters in the NU tier. Im not sure which would be best for this team, maybe camerupt, bastiodon, or probo, but although you want both on a team, if you have something that can set up toxic spikes, you should go for it.

 

[BurtonEarny]

Toxic Spikes
(also, in that case I nominate we run Ice Beam over Toxic)

REASON FOR TOXIC SPIKES-
-Another great asset that toxic spikes offers is that it can sometimes completely change the switches an opponent would make simply because they are down. While it doesn't force in grounded poisons, most players will want them gone as quickly as possible. SR is much more common than TS and finding better users of this entry hazard will be difficult. For the ability to control switches and because of the relative ease of finding a better SR users I think TS is warranted.

REASONS FOR ICE BEAM-
-In my eyes there are few pokemon that you are going to want to bother hitting with toxic when you have the option of nailing a grounded poison/ grass (or just a mono grass) type on the switch with an ice beam. In addition to allowing some good damage on the switch, it also allows us to kill bravairy and swellow quickly which is nice due to a lack of recovery on Omanytes part without having to predict (ice beam will deal significant damage to the birds while dealing much better damage than hp rock to possible grass types switches such as tangela and exeggutor).
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Also, while it will take a good chunk of ev's to do so, I think I would at least test making it outspeed the standard lead golem as a way to remove SR from the game early. Scald it and if you fail to burn or it has a lum, then it has to switch or die allowing you to come in and spin asap. Because it will be so low on hp and so slow, it shouldn't be able to get up another SR for the remainder of the game. Its fairly niche, but I felt it warranted mention, that is, if the change will not stop it from being able to effectively wall the likes of swellow and braviary. If Icy Wind actually did okay damage to common grass types then it could be used as a way to beat golem early without investing into speed ev's, but it would be less reliable and just less effective across the board.

 

[Tribute]

Toxic Spikes

Camerupt or even another pokemon all together can handle rocks just as well, but toxic spikes are a crucial part of a stall team, and this provides the opportunity without sacrificing a whole team slot to somethings who role is "T-Spikes, then die". I don't really feel the need to write much more because pretty much everything would just be even more repetition of what everyone else has said.

 

[Vintage Books]

Toxic Spikes.

Toxic spikes have more of a utility for stall teams. Stealth rock is also a very common move so it is quite easy the find a place for it on a team, because such a large amount of pokes have it. Toxic Spikes are also generally better for stall so thats the main reason.

 

[MMF]

Toxic Spikes


Basically for the above reasons. SR is easy to find and Tspikes has waaay more utility. And it gives us more freedom with the team.

 

[Django]

Toxic Spikes

Wasting another team slot on Toxic Spikes will come back to hurt us later, we may as well use them on Omanyte now.

 

[spuds4ever]

Toxic Spikes

For reasons already stated. I also agree with changing toxic to ice beam.

 

[Raseri]

Ok it is decided. Toxic Spikes will go over Stealth Rock on Omanyte.

Hide

Tropius @ Sitrus Berry
Trait: Harvest
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 Spd
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Leech Seed
- Protect
- Substitute
- Air Slash

Omanyte @ Eviolite
Shell Armor
252HP/252Def/4Spdef
Bold (+Def -Atk)
~ Scald
~ Spikes
~ Toxic Spikes
~Toxic

Feel free to nominate for a third Pokemon again!

 

[BurtonEarny]

vote on Ice Beam > Toxic? It just seems like the superior option in this case for this move set. I second Camerupt, still.

 

[Ewil]

Yep Toxic is a little redudant on that set and Ice beam fill perfectly.

Also i support Camerupt.

Question: If i propose a pokémon's set and it will not voted, can i re-propose that set for another team slot ?

 

[Raseri]

After a lot of thought I've decided to close this CCAT for a few reasons.

With the release of BW2 the route we are going with the team would have to be massively reworked, as the release of Regenerator Amoonguss and Regenerator Alomomola, as well as Skill Link Cinccino threaten our first two Pokemon. And with the massive metagame changes about to happen I believe it will be better if we start a new CCAT when things begin to settle, as during the upcoming few months massive changes are going to happen to NU as new sets are discovered, Pokemon rise and fall, so when things settle down a bit we will take a second stab at the process, hopefully with more of a goal in mind.

I apologize to the people contributing to the process, but I hope you will join us when we start anew in the new metagame :)